Sorry I come across that way, but I'm not the only one who picked PSU, go up a few posts. Gable and I were in HS at the same time. He went to West in Waterloo, I went to CF, I think I was a year or two older. At any rate I was sick when he went to ISU not Iowa, although absolutely right move for him. I'm not sure fading the obvious is in any way helpful to the team other than optics. Maybe next season I'll work on my tone. BTW I'm pretty sure Rusty was born Rush Hudson Limbaugh, Rusty was a nick name.
We need a change at the top
- Thread starter Hawkmen
- Start date
Nice first post. I read very little of the dribble on this board (and the Lounge) after a big loss. The negative "fans" are out in droves. I'm sure people want Fran fired over there as we write.
I think most of the people that post here this time of year must be multiple time HS and NCAA champs. I know I wrestled some kids that were just better and more talented than I was, and believe it or not, I found it very hard to take them down repeatedly and get to my offense at will.
Apparently they never ever had that issue.
Our staff gets the most out of what they have. It is really up to them to just someway get better recurits easier said than done. Who really can coach a lot better than Tom and Terry. It has been said over and over it is the Hawks not getting enough top studs.
For a example:
Lets say its baseball and my team has all 8 home run hitters and I also have 4 of the top pitchers.
You guys that say need a coach change have 8 single hitters and so so pitching staff who the hell is going to win the majority of time.?
Out staff can coach as good as any out there just have to step up the recuriting and will be fine, heck we had a chance for 5 in the finals and not one of them was in top 10 in the nation in high school Penn State has a whole dam team of them and can have 4-5 riding the bench any one with half a brain can see why they are winning..Know it hurts and I don't like it erither but dam the Hawks will come back keep the faith.
For a example:
Lets say its baseball and my team has all 8 home run hitters and I also have 4 of the top pitchers.
You guys that say need a coach change have 8 single hitters and so so pitching staff who the hell is going to win the majority of time.?
Out staff can coach as good as any out there just have to step up the recuriting and will be fine, heck we had a chance for 5 in the finals and not one of them was in top 10 in the nation in high school Penn State has a whole dam team of them and can have 4-5 riding the bench any one with half a brain can see why they are winning..Know it hurts and I don't like it erither but dam the Hawks will come back keep the faith.
LOL with your Pariano idea. WTF? I have heard he would be lucky to get a job after the NW issue.
Sounds like a plan Bernie Sanders, didn't know you were a wrestling fan.
If we're a basketball state that would come as a big surprise to basketball fans around the country.
So many bad ideas on this thread that I don't know where to start (e.g. try to hire Kale, make TB give a presser, bring in Pariano ASAP, etc., etc.), so I won't. None of these can redo the last 10 matches of this year's Nationals or improve our outlook for next year, but some could hurt it. We're all disappointed, but not all of us are desperate and/or stupid.
For what its worth, we aren't the only Div I wrestling power that collapsed this year. Look north. (Cue Jammen) Note also that the Clones and UNI weren't exactly goliaths this year either. Maybe this is also regional. Perhaps there are some demographic changes that are beyond a coach's control that contribute. If so, why haven't they affected Okie state as well?
The new UI president is a business and results guy, and poor wrestling is bad for business. My guess is that TnT will be given a pass for this year's collapse, and if/when it happens again next year, the AD will assemble some advisory committee (Gable, Alger, Ironside, Bolwsby, whoever) to make recommendations. (I wish they would also ask some of the Einsteins here (GG, Tarp, etc.), but they won't.) At any rate, TB will see the writing on the wall long before this and make some wholesale changes, but if those don't work, he'll be leaving.
For what its worth, we aren't the only Div I wrestling power that collapsed this year. Look north. (Cue Jammen) Note also that the Clones and UNI weren't exactly goliaths this year either. Maybe this is also regional. Perhaps there are some demographic changes that are beyond a coach's control that contribute. If so, why haven't they affected Okie state as well?
The new UI president is a business and results guy, and poor wrestling is bad for business. My guess is that TnT will be given a pass for this year's collapse, and if/when it happens again next year, the AD will assemble some advisory committee (Gable, Alger, Ironside, Bolwsby, whoever) to make recommendations. (I wish they would also ask some of the Einsteins here (GG, Tarp, etc.), but they won't.) At any rate, TB will see the writing on the wall long before this and make some wholesale changes, but if those don't work, he'll be leaving.
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Seriously, you haters need to STFU! Our coaches are doing an outstanding job with the wrestlers we have. Just because things didn't go our way this year doesn't mean it won't next year. Take a chill pill and drink a Bud Light. The future looks bright for Hawkeye wrestling!
If you are too dense to realize that Ramos, McD, Metcalf and Borschel would be bigger names on the recruiting trail and better coaches in the room then you shouldn't even be in these discussions. These kids come to Iowa because of our history and our facilities and our staff. The proof is in the pudding and M*'s guys have under performed ever since he got here.
I don't think I disagreed with any of your analysis or reasoning, but your tone and the way you stated things sure made you seem like a PSU troll to me rather than an Iowa fan. Don't know why your posts came across that way to me. Could be just me I guess.
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I too am mystified with the idea of replacing Brands with Pariano or Perry. Perry has brought to IL a couple of talented recruits from CA (Delgado and Imar), but beyond that, I don't know that his coaching chops are anything special. Northwestern pulls in some top recruits, as they are an Ivy school equivalent, but beyond that....Pariano has accomplished exactly what, that we should be so impressed with?
Huh?? The Hawks were a final four team under Lute Olsen and had many great years during the 80s and 90s, the same time Gable was bringing home the hardware. Your idea of Iowa becoming more of a basketball state is like saying Florida is becoming more a of prime area for hunting polar bears...just don't see it.
Lol!
"Why do I have to repeat myself? I well tell you the same thing I told you the last five years -- next year will be better!"
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No excuse for Gilman to look that poor .......................... ????? You people are pathetic. What was so poor about Gilman, he left every ounce of his blood, sweat and tears on the mat, ever match. More than many of so-called Iowa fans can say. So, he pinned the National Champion who hadn't lost a match in forever, and lost to a great wrestler. Why do we have to take something away from Megaludis and disrespect our wrestler, and then turn around and call ourselves "hawk fans".
And let's jump on the band wagon of coach bashing ........................ pathetic.
Huh?? The Hawks were a final four team under Lute Olsen and had many great years during the 80s and 90s, the same time Gable was bringing home the hardware. Your idea of Iowa becoming more of a basketball state is like saying Florida is becoming more a of prime area for hunting polar bears...just don't see it.
I was talking about the state at the high school level. I think it's very fair the say that more kids are interested in basketball than wrestling than it was in the past. Iowa HS basketball is getting pretty good compared to years past, and the wrestling appears to have gone stagnant.
I will say now though, that the emergence in club wrestling in the state is going to be bring that back up.
Drew Pariano as a head coach would turn things around at Iowa. He is a brilliant recruiter and works well with high profile studs. He would have easily gotten Mark Hall. I've known Drew personally for over ten years. He can turn around any program. The AD ,imho,at NU killed wrestling by not supporting wrestling and capping roster at 23 kids. Talk to Herbert,Welch,Precin,Lang,Fox,Tamillow, Trirtsis.All those guys have been ranked number one nationally except for Tamillow,who was ranked number one in freestyle. All those studs beat Iowa kids and most were top recruits.
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Welch NEVER beat St. John in college. & if you want to credit him for recruiting, then credit him for Tsirtsis regressing from a stud HS recruit who dominated everyone, including beating Retherford in freestyle, to one of the most boring wrestlers in NCAA wrestling content to win 2-1 on riding time. McDonough > Precin, although he was certainly a stud. He would NOT turn things around at Iowa.
Wrestling is thriving at the youth level in Iowa, to suggest otherwise means you are out of touch. The last couple freshman classes have been some of the best we've seen.
And how many top 5 finishes did he have with all those high profile studs he works with???
IMHO it comes down to a few things - 1) Gable was unique and coached at a time when scholarship rules and coaching rules were different. A coach like Gable comes along once in a lifetime (Cael may be from the same mold) He cultivated a culture of winning! People wanted to be around it and involved in it. He made EXCELLENT Kool-Aid and everyone in the program drank it happily. 2) Brands was the beneficiary of TWO recruiting classes (his and Zelesky's) for 4 years. Not to mention the Iowa wrestling brand. It meant quite a bit to wrestle for Iowa. I believe Zalesky was the scapegoat for standards that were impossible to live up to (Gable) especially with all the rule changes and the number of Gable trained coaches teaching the same thing (albeit probably not as well) as Gable. 3) Everyone else was catching up. Gable trained many wrestlers and coaches who went on to other programs with great success. Its great for the sport of wrestling but NOT SO GREAT for maintaining superiority over all opponents. 4) Iowa USED to turn out premiere high school wrestlers in the nation - NOW Pennsylvania does. Iowa has 3 programs to share in-state talent. PSU is undoubtedly the big dog in Pennsylvania. 5) Cael is highly respected by many around the country and conducts himself with class as a true ambassador of the sport. At times - Brands bros behave like half-cocked spoiled children who have the respect of most Iowa wrestling fans. (Brands has Gable's intensity but lacks his class) 6) Recruiting becomes a problem when you start to slip - now you have to SELL the program - it no longer SELLS itself. (See Notre Dame football over the years) I'll end there - I could list others - but truth be told - Iowa is still the envy of MANY programs, but NO LONGER are they as dominant. Gable was SPECIAL! Cael may be too. TIme will tell. Brands was a special wrestler - I think his coaching lacks in a few areas. He is still an exceptional coach but is NOT Gable and they don't come along often. Thank Goodness you had him as long as you did! END OF RANT11
Could be....but better get somebody who can recruit out of state (for sure Pennsylvania); demographics is beating the hell out of Iowa. PA with 13 million and Ohio with 12 million (and both with high school programs the equal of Iowa and its 3 million) simply produce more studs. Look at Intermat HS rankings....PA with 5 Number 1's and a batch of 2,3,4s; Iowa with no 1's and a couple of 4's. And it is always much easier to recruit in your own back yard.
I have little doubt that Brands would have taken the Penn State team and whipped Cael's Iowa team just like actually happened. Demographics is destiny....lucky that wrestling is not a warm-weather sport or California, Texas, and Florida would be eating all our lunches.
That wasn't the point of my reply. He tried suggesting Iowa kids are turning to basketball instead of wrestling. Maybe read the post before turning it into a Brands can't recruit post. Do you join the conversation often, or are you a post NCAA troll?
Was a defense of Brands, not an attack. He can coach with anyone....he's at a recruiting disadvantage based on geography/demographics. Same as Ferentz compared to Urban over the long haul.
I do know they wrestle in California. Very little support in colleges, however. Is a troll someone who disagrees with you? You seem a little chippy, chopper.
Guess I get tired of the negativity of the post NCAA lurkers.
We return 5 All Americans and 3 are NCAA finalist. Sure it isn't what Penn State has coming back, but it pretty darn good. With the addition of Kemerer a healthy Stoll and possibily Marinelli things aren't as bad as they are being made out to be.
We in complete agreement on the negativity. People slamming athletes busting their tail chaps my tail. Cranking on the coach doesn't bother me much.....they're paid to accept abuse. Anyway, my point was....flip Brands and Cael, Penn State still whips everybody.
Yes, next year has potential.
Man I would love Burroughs as a coach! Think of the athletes that would want to wrestle for him. We would be swimming in Nashon Garret, David Taylor, Ed Ruth, I Mart types. I would loveeeee that. If only there was a way. I think he would absolutely take a head coaching position at Iowa after he gets done in Rio
Robinson graduated in '69, I think Gable was a year behind me which means he's 1 yr younger than JR.
