Wednesday copium

[goldmom]

We have christian friends that believe the man has the final say and the women has to follow. If you've ever been around Orthodox Jews you'll find the women are second class to the men. Just look at it this way, the guy that won has admitted to grabbing women where ever he wants, he has lost lawsuits for rape, he's cheated on his wife multiple times and even with a porn star, he physically abused a past wife, I could go on, and yet people will still vote for him when he's running against a women. The only time he lost was when running against a man. Honestly if you don't care about how a man treats women, you must not have much respect for women, so why would you be willing to vote for a women.

Number one learn the difference between woman and women.
Second you insult Christian and Orthodox Jews…
Third I think a NY jury convicted Trump of assault, not rape? As soon as Jean Carroll gets home from her self described shopping spree let’s ask her.

 

[goldmom]

No, they didn't. Trump called half the country "enemies" and worse. It's a terribly tired take to think people marched into the polls saying "I'm voting for Trump because the departing President maybe called me garbage!" Particularly when these same people have been saying for four years, "do you miss the mean tweets guy?"

Hmm. Enemy vs garbage. Okay. 🙄

 

[Aardvark86]

We have christian friends that believe the man has the final say and the women has to follow. If you've ever been around Orthodox Jews you'll find the women are second class to the men. Just look at it this way, the guy that won has admitted to grabbing women where ever he wants, he has lost lawsuits for rape, he's cheated on his wife multiple times and even with a porn star, he physically abused a past wife, I could go on, and yet people will still vote for him when he's running against a women. The only time he lost was when running against a man. Honestly if you don't care about how a man treats women, you must not have much respect for women, so why would you be willing to vote for a women.

The reality is such extremes are just that.

 

[WadeLookingbill]

Hmm. Enemy vs garbage. Okay. 🙄

LOL

 

[Hans81]

yeah, i haven't seen the 'full' cross tabs on this, but at one point last night somebody said that one of the "most important issues" in exit polls was "danger to democracy." Now I'd think almost anybody would think that's a d-friendly group of voters, but I could have sworn that last night i heard some commentator say that for some jurisdiction, that broke R. Again, maybe i misheard, but if that's correct, I guess it would mean that 'lawfare' was perceived to be real.

Beyond that, from what i heard, economy was #1/2, and abortion and immigration were materially behind the economy and democracy. That is a little stunning to me too. At a higher philosophical level, it raises future questions about strategies based on teh aggregate effects of microtargeting, versus strategies based on macrotargeting.

I think the “threat to democracy” from a Republican perspective is that if the border remained wide open, eventually the Dems would give all these illegal migrants amnesty and eventual citizenship/voting rights. Thereby, most of those individuals would likely vote for a Democrat president and the Republicans would essentially be “locked out” of the presidency.

 

[Hans81]

I'm going to take it further, very religious people won't vote for a women. And that can be any religion, Catholics, Jews, etc.

Hogwash…a good woman candidate will get votes.

 

[Hans81]

Does Trump come across as likeable or smart? I'm always just confused by these pot shots taken at Harris. I don't think it's mysogyny or racism either, FYI.

Not more “likeable”, but Trump does come across with more “street” smart common sense.

 

[TennNole17]

What's a copium?

 

[SB_SB]

Number one learn the difference between woman and women.
Second you insult Christian and Orthodox Jews…
Third I think a NY jury convicted Trump of assault, not rape? As soon as Jean Carroll gets home from her self described shopping spree let’s ask her.

Someone is a little touchy, do you feel guilty at all about your vote?

Sorry I didn't proofread before sending, it's a message board, so deal with it. Second, do some research and you'll find it wasn't an insult, it's the truth. My Christian friends will tell you that the man has the final say.

You're exactly the type of person I'm talking about. I'll give you assault rather than rape, but you have to give me that he said he can grab women by the pussy and it's ok. Here you are, willing to accept sexual assault over voting for a female. You've proved my point by just responding to the post. Thanks for validating me.

 

[SB_SB]

Hogwash…a good woman candidate will get votes.

Of course she's going to get votes, Harris got votes. She just won't get enough votes.

 

[TNHAWK79]

The problem, apparently, is that our STILL misogynistic society is not limited to white males; it appears to bleed into our minority population, as well. Which is one of the most disappointing discoveries in this election. I believe the Democrats have to understand that our country is not yet ready to elect a female as President. And while I am a huge fan of Mayor Pete, this tells me he is better suited to run as VP, where he can so articulately explain the Democratic position without losing too many of the otherwise Democratic voters who are still homophobes.

That must be it.. Or, and I’m just thinking out loud, she was a terrible candidate and no one believed her. America doesn’t have a problem with a woman as president, they had a problem with Kamala. Don’t make it more complicated than what it is.

 

[Greenway4Prez]

I’m sorry, I simply cannot take any Democrat complaining about misinformation seriously. They have zero, ZERO legs to stand on.

Obama and Harris, both in the final week leading up to the election, had the arrogance to repeat the “good people on both sides” lie/hoax that has been debunked repeatedly. They think people are stupid and aren’t going to notice? That may play with their base, but it doesn’t with people who don’t lap up what their told and have the capability of fact-checking these things themselves.

There have been so many instances of the media outright lying to people, thinking that they wouldn’t notice, that compiling a list would be a pretty tall task. Biden’s mental health, Harris and the 60 Minutes interview being doctored, Trump calling for Cheney to face a firing squad…I could go on and on and on.

People don’t like being lied to. And they especially don’t like it when the liars are unapologetic about it. And they really, REALLY don’t like it when nothing is learned and the liars find another lie to repeat. And they REALLY REALLY REALLY don’t like it when it is a coordinated, intentional effort by multiple parties.

 

[MitchLL]

The average voter isn't engaged at all. They are mostly just voting based on a general feeling or concept, but a lot of the issues that drive engaged voters. The kind of people that post on HBOT don't even register for large segment of people entering the voting booth. That is why Trump's fifth grade communication approach is effective electorally. There are engaged voters who want nuance and policy but they are the minority.

Agree.
Dems need to aim for a more uninformed voter.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Have you been making interesting points?

Always.

I don't typically read your posts.

I don't typically read yours either.

Doesn't mean we can't help each other........

 

[MichaelKeller99]

Does Trump come across as likeable or smart? I'm always just confused by these pot shots taken at Harris. I don't think it's mysogyny or racism either, FYI.

Smart? Not to me, at least not book smarts. He does have street smarts when it comes to dealing with the media, though.

Likable? I would submit he is more likable to HIS base than Harris is to HERS. Again, not my cup of tea - he’s acts too much like the class bully.

I despise Hillary but would much rather spend time with her (if forced ) or listen to her than having anything to do with Kamala. Hillary is extremely intelligent.

 

[hawkeyeandy]

Number one learn the difference between woman and women.

Thank you.

 

[EvilMonkeyInTheCloset]

Dude this constant tagging me in posts is just weird. (For you, yes, I'm sure it is......)

You seem to think I absolutely loved Harris or something, which is just not true and I said it on here many times.

I'm personally completely fine (You seemed to have a problem with what I said a few days ago. Funny how that changes so you can get out of confrontations..........🤫) , so if you want to have some weird fantasy about me crying in my beer you're wrong. (You already fulfilled it. Now Im just waiting for RileyHawk to come out of hiding......) I went and took my middle kid to play basketball last night until about 9:00 and when I got back it was basically over to anybody who wasn't trying to find some reason why Harris won. (Neat.) I posted on here a few times and played some 2k and went to bed. I woke up and am working today. Life goes on.

2k?...........2k is not for grown-ups.

 

[Rifler]

What's a copium?

Cope + Opium

 

[bdcolt45er]

I’m sorry, I simply cannot take any Democrat complaining about misinformation seriously. They have zero, ZERO legs to stand on.

Obama and Harris, both in the final week leading up to the election, had the arrogance to repeat the “good people on both sides” lie/hoax that has been debunked repeatedly. They think people are stupid and aren’t going to notice? That may play with their base, but it doesn’t with people who don’t lap up what their told and have the capability of fact-checking these things themselves.

There have been so many instances of the media outright lying to people, thinking that they wouldn’t notice, that compiling a list would be a pretty tall task. Biden’s mental health, Harris and the 60 Minutes interview being doctored, Trump calling for Cheney to face a firing squad…I could go on and on and on.

People don’t like being lied to. And they especially don’t like it when the liars are unapologetic about it. And they really, REALLY don’t like it when nothing is learned and the liars find another lie to repeat. And they REALLY REALLY REALLY don’t like it when it is a coordinated, intentional effort by multiple parties.

I don't know, the evidence suggests to me that people are perfectly happy to be lied to. It depends on what lie is being told and who is saying it.

 

[Aardvark86]

Cope + Opium

Shit. I thought it was "Cocksucker" + "Opprobrium"

 

[TC Nole OX]

I don't know, the evidence suggests to me that people are perfectly happy to be lied to. It depends on what lie is being told and who is saying it.

So long as the right people are hated, they’ll support just about anything

 

[ISUBryce]

2k?...........2k is not for grown-ups.

The outcome yesterday doesn't change anything I said. I appears that you think you have me in some kind of "gotcha" situation, but I'm not surprised by anything that's happened. I think I must have just done a really poor job explaining my position, and if that's the case well bummer. I'm not the best communicator. Everything I said I stand by even if badly said.

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

You still don’t get it. The border wall will be completed and the former remain in Mexico policy, etc will be re-enacted, thus the border “issue” and problems will organically diminish.

You really think so?

 

[Formerly Rockymtnole]

People don’t like being lied to. And they especially don’t like it when the liars are unapologetic about it. And they really, REALLY don’t like it when nothing is learned and the liars find another lie to repeat. And they REALLY REALLY REALLY don’t like it when it is a coordinated, intentional effort by multiple parties.

If this was true Trump would’ve never gotten out of the 2016 primary.

 

[goldmom]

I'm going to take it further, very religious people won't vote for a women. And that can be any religion, Catholics, Jews, etc.

OMG.
Ignorance knows no bounds.
Are you referring to the group of extremists masquerading as an alleged “faith” like modern day radical Islam?

 

[SB_SB]

OMG.
Ignorance knows no bounds.
Are you referring to the group of extremists masquerading as an alleged “faith” like modern day radical Islam?

No, they're not extremists, they're your neighbors and people you deal with on a daily basis. There's a reason there were commercials telling women voters that they can think for themselves and not follow their husbands. That is a real thing in some religious circles. There's also the trend of trad wives that tend to let their husband make the call.

 

[Dr. Phil Seuss]

Deleted my Twitter already and having an HBOT ignore party today.

Best advice I can think of for handling what happened is to worry about controlling what you can control. For those of us in this nation who can see Trump for the awful awful human being that he is and the grave threat to our democracy, which he stands for now, we really can only stand back and watch.

So the only thing to do is try to control what you can control and begin self reflecting on what needs to be done and what went wrong so that just doesn’t happen again. The truth is the Democrats have made a lot of mistakes these last eight years.

First and foremost to me is they have learned nothing about what is going on and how Trump got it in 2016. They have no answer for the disinformation machine and the ability to try to combat that despite knowing this has been going on for nine years now.

Joe Biden well forever, have his legacy diminished by trying to seek a second term when he was so clearly unable to lead the country for another 5 1/2 years. The result was, we had a rushed replacement candidate that was weaker at stopping MAGA even than Hillary Clinton.

It was very foolish to think in these times to think that a black woman could beat Trump. It’s just a fact and sad. She was the only choice due to timing. Any hope she had would have had would have been dependent on Shapiro pushing her to a slim victory in blue wall so that was a catastrophic mistake we can all see now. Walz did nothing.

The Democrats are going to have to figure out how to run better candidates for president in this new entertainment politics era. Substance matters little. Charisma and looks and TV time matter a lot. And they have to figure out how to combat disinformation or perhaps fight back the same way, sadly.

Man, sounds like you’re taking this all quite well and you sound like a totally reasonable, measured adult.

Hilarious you pulled the race and gender cards, failing to acknowledge reality in that Kamala Harris was not chosen to be VP because she had talent, she was chosen only because she was a black woman. Anyone disputing that can agree to disagree. She was a bad candidate, had no business being in that place to begin with.

The left lost their way. Tried playing the Rights game of pandering to the lowest common denominators and it just so happens more people are turned off by that than by Trumps insanity.

This a woman who was stomped in 2020, dropped out of the race before any primary votes were cast, and was thought to be a liability to Biden this spring. Anyone that thought this was going to end with her victorious is an absolute sucker.

 

[goldmom]

No, they're not extremists, they're your neighbors and people you deal with on a daily basis. There's a reason there were commercials telling women voters that they can think for themselves and not follow their husbands. That is a real thing in some religious circles. There's also the trend of trad wives that tend to let their husband make the call.

🫢 Quick! Tell me who my extremist neighbors are. Now I’m in a panic.
I never saw a commercial where men in a free country where women can vote tried to tell their wives they were allowed to choose who to vote for?

 

[goldmom]

Man, sounds like you’re taking this all quite well and you sound like a totally reasonable, measured adult.

Hilarious you pulled the race and gender cards, failing to acknowledge reality in that Kamala Harris was not chosen to be VP because she had talent, she was chosen only because she was a black woman. Anyone disputing that can agree to disagree. She was a bad candidate, had no business being in that place to begin with.

The left lost their way. Tried playing the Rights game of pandering to the lowest common denominators and it just so happens more people are turned off by that than by Trumps insanity.

This a woman who was stomped in 2020, dropped out of the race before any primary votes were cast, and was thought to be a liability to Biden this spring. Anyone that thought this was going to end with her victorious is an absolute sucker.

And lest we forget it was another woman - Tulsi Gabbard - who ended her campaign before it got off the ground.

 

[Greenway4Prez]

If this was true Trump would’ve never gotten out of the 2016 primary.

It’s one thing when a person lies, especially when that’s their reputation. And, right or wrong, it’s generally been accepted that anyone running for office is going to lie. Yes, Trump takes it beyond the pale, but….

It’s another thing when the people who are relied upon to report the news and current events are the ones lying. And they’re lying about the liar. There have been so many chances for SOMEONE to step back and say, “You know, this guy is willing to dig himself a hole, why do we keep giving him an out by editing and misrepresentating and lying about what he says or does?” The media has eroded its own credibility, and they have a long road to getting it back.

 

[SB_SB]

🫢 Quick! Tell me who my extremist neighbors are. Now I’m in a panic.
I never saw a commercial where men in a free country where women can vote tried to tell their wives they were allowed to choose who to vote for?

I already told you, they're not extremist, they're normal people that you deal with. There are reasons that women, much like yourself, are willing to vote for male who is guilty of sexual assault rather than vote for a female. The democrats need to learn from this election and know their audience and adjust to them. I'm not telling you that you need to change, you are who you are, the democrats need to make the change and learn from the error they made.

So you're saying you didn't see the commercial telling women that they can vote for whoever they want and not have to tell their husband?

Let's state the obvious, trump is the only president where his election wins are against women. He's never beaten a male. It kind of makes me think there should be an asterisk next to his wins.

 

[SL Hawk Fan]

People want to blame misogyny and racism. They just don’t want to admit that she comes across as unlikable and, uh, not smart.

Well, when you consider that Trump is less likable and even less smart, misogyny and racism is really all you have left.

 

[seminole97]

Agree.
Dems need to aim for a more uninformed voter.

DR STOCKMAN: "The majority is never right... Who makes up the majority in any country--the intelligent, or the stupid? I think we've got to agree that, all over this whole wide earth, the stupid are in a fearsomely overpowering majority. But I'll be damned to perdition if it's part of the eternal plan that the stupid are meant to rule the intelligent!"

-Henrik Ibsen, An Enemy of the People

 

[mro1978]

so what we learned from this thread is that the left now hates latino men..........racists

 

[Hans81]

Of course she's going to get votes, Harris got votes. She just won't get enough votes.

I should have been more clear…a good, centrist woman candidate will eventually become president. Kamala doesn’t fit that description.

 

[DooBi]

My take....Covid response in 2020 was the reason Trump lost.

Then four years later, that shitty Covid response led to product shortages and the ensuing price gouging that flamed inflation and voters blamed the Party in the WH.

Two elections affected by Covid.
Voters rewarded the original culprit.
Ain't Merica great?

Better than every other nation I was told. So they were rewarding the original hero right? Lol

 

[SB_SB]

I should have been more clear…a good, centrist woman candidate will eventually become president. Kamala doesn’t fit that description.

For me personally I have no problem voting for a women and have multiple times. But for trying to get independents or republicans to cross over, a woman isn't going to work.

As an independent the smart thing for the dems to have done would have been to pick Liz Chaney to replace Biden and leave Kamala as VP. The goal should have been to defeat trump the best way possible.

 

[goldmom]

For me personally I have no problem voting for a women and have multiple times. But for trying to get independents or republicans to cross over, a woman isn't going to work.

As an independent the smart thing for the dems to have done would have been to pick Liz Chaney to replace Biden and leave Kamala as VP. The goal should have been to defeat trump the best way possible.

I’m a woman who has voted for women candidates across the Board. And I’m a Republican- who’s voted for Democrat women. If they are the best candidate why wouldn’t I?

 

[SB_SB]

I’m a woman who has voted for women candidates across the Board. And I’m a Republican- who’s voted for Democrat women. If they are the best candidate why wouldn’t I?

But you are educated and you have life experiences. Those are two key components to making informed decisions.

 

[MitchLL]

Better than every other nation I was told. So they were rewarding the original hero right? Lol

Biden's covid response was better.
That's not arguable.

What's not known is if Trump hadn't ignored Covid from November 2019 until March 2020...would less people have died?
We both know that answer.