Fire Brands
- Thread starter vhsalum
- Start date
As a Badger fan, we'll gladly take the brands off your hands.
Just looking at Iowa guys for assistant coaches is a mistake.
I did not read through this thread but wanted to post my opinion. I think restructuring our staff could really benefit our team.
Move Terry to the HWC.
Telford is probably a great guy. But imo our bigs have not got much better from 1st year to last year. Warner is a 4X AA going 7,4,2,5. Cass is going to be a 4X AA going 3,7,4, and probably 2-5 next year.
Why can’t Iowa go get a Snyder, Cox, Gwiz, Trevel. Pay them assistant money plus HWC$ to get them here.
I would love to see more of free flow scrambling type guy on staff as well. I would have loved to kept Kemerer.
My wish list would be a bigs coach listed above
and another younger guy like Nolf, Dake, JB, Zain, Yianni
Move Terry to the HWC.
Telford is probably a great guy. But imo our bigs have not got much better from 1st year to last year. Warner is a 4X AA going 7,4,2,5. Cass is going to be a 4X AA going 3,7,4, and probably 2-5 next year.
Why can’t Iowa go get a Snyder, Cox, Gwiz, Trevel. Pay them assistant money plus HWC$ to get them here.
I would love to see more of free flow scrambling type guy on staff as well. I would have loved to kept Kemerer.
My wish list would be a bigs coach listed above
and another younger guy like Nolf, Dake, JB, Zain, Yianni
Firing the Brands Bros would be huge mistake for several reasons. They CAN recruit and recruit well- seems they got a sweet Oklahoma boy some years ago, pried Mocco away from OKST, got DeSanto to transfer, Lee to leave PA, Cass to hop over instead of going to MN which inexplicably makes men of hvywt boys, Woods to leave Stanford, need I go on?
Back in the 70s, everyone wanted to be with Dan Gable. Afterwards it was John Smith. Both men CHANGED the game. Now everyone wants to train under Sanderson, guess what? They get the pick of the litter. Are you really willing to gamble on a Taylor, Dake, Burroughs, Snyder, Yianni??
Brands are still a VERY big draw. And it seems to me that they care about their wrestlers. You got yourselves two very, very good years quite recently. Others have shown that the PA boys CAN be beat on the big stage.
I don't have any eureka answers, but I would put Lee on staff somehow, maybe recruiting. He doesn't mind talking up the program, and you need that. Not saying you need to fire Morningstar.
Back in the 70s, everyone wanted to be with Dan Gable. Afterwards it was John Smith. Both men CHANGED the game. Now everyone wants to train under Sanderson, guess what? They get the pick of the litter. Are you really willing to gamble on a Taylor, Dake, Burroughs, Snyder, Yianni??
Brands are still a VERY big draw. And it seems to me that they care about their wrestlers. You got yourselves two very, very good years quite recently. Others have shown that the PA boys CAN be beat on the big stage.
I don't have any eureka answers, but I would put Lee on staff somehow, maybe recruiting. He doesn't mind talking up the program, and you need that. Not saying you need to fire Morningstar.
Solid Take.
Let's too remember up until right now, Iowa was coming to the recruiting wars with a knife instead of a gun. All things are now possible
Think about Cass’s situation. Guy came in ready to all American. But who does he have that can help develope him to win it. He was better as a freshman than Telford was as a senior(nothing against Telford - great dude I’m sure).
Same can be said for kennedy.
Take an honest look at Tony's freshman matches. He's improved a tremendous amount. If you think finishing 7th at Midlands means he's ready to AA then we can agree to disagree.
Ready to AA and maybe better than Telford in his RS-freshman year. But true-freshman Cass had significant wrinkles to iron out.
I'm probably one who thinks some new upper weight coaching blood would be wise, but it's still mostly raw talent at issue. Mason and Kerk just superior in that regard, imo. Do we really think if Karl and Co. coached our upper guys that we would see Nelson>Starroci or Assad>Brooks. I don't, though *possible* they might have improved more.
Cass smashed Paris summer after senior year. So….
No not a brands to a starocci level for sure. Brands was late to the game and not a blue chip recruit.
We are so worried about hiring only former hawks as coaches it’s been very limiting.
Look at poeta - guarantee we see an uptick in 157 to 197 development over the next few years at Illinois. Ruth and imar coaching there. Both multiple time champs. World team members. Hell - imar took a match from Burroughs.
Same can be said about Andrew Howe coaching at NW previously - that yielded the development of deakin. Top contender and scorer year after year and then champ.
How many ncaa titles do we have coaching our upper weights at the Mecca of college wrestling? Z E R O
Parris was super raw and a complete novice in freestyle at that point. Still, he was a much higher rated recruit than Cass because it was pretty easy to see that his ceiling was very high.
I am about as big of a fan of Tony as it gets. But, he wrestles like a heavyweight. A really good one, but still limited in speed and level changes. His body type, even with the leaner transformation, isn’t the fast twitch kind. This showed so much more than it normally would because he ran into a wall of freak athletes in Steveson, Parris and Kerkvliet. They were all just as strong and so much faster.
I don’t care who you had coaching Cass, he would have to wrestle the perfect match(which he almost did once against Mason) and even then would need a little luck…
Just sounds like more justifying of being homers for Iowa upper weight coaching instead of being about the business of winning. Which means getting the best wrestlers to develop and the best coaches to develop them.
In upper weights we just don’t have it. Sooner we make course correction and quit making excuses the sooner we start winning titles again.
In upper weights we just don’t have it. Sooner we make course correction and quit making excuses the sooner we start winning titles again.
My point has nothing to do with that. I don’t care if you get a different upper weight coach or not. I was simply saying it hasn’t been so much about the guns and much more so about the bullets.
The ONLY top 10 recruit at the upper weights has been Warner. He was a 4x AA and a Finalist. Now, maybe a different upper weight coach helps bring in more higher ranked upper weights, but the argument of it being solely about development simply isn’t true…
Noted - just agreeing to disagree. I gotta think that being in a room with Carl, Varner, Snyder would have made cass a little better than he was this year than with our current coaches…
And you make a good point about getting more too recruits up top with top coaches.
Yep let’s fire Tom and his staff. That’s the answer. This is the reason I get frustrated being a Hawk fan sometimes.
1. Yep fire a 3 time champ and gold medal winner obviously knows nothing about wrestling. Oh wait fire Terry who has a few medals himself and actually coached a few that have won a few medals as well. Fire M* yep fire the guy that convinced guys like Young, Kemdawg, Marinelli, PK, Chittum, etc to come to Iowa. Fire Telford look were Nelson finished the year, got Warner to the finals and to AA in probably the 2nd toughest weight in the country and done some really nice things with a bit of a undersized and not the most athletic hwt in Cass. Remember how Carl couldn’t beat at isu and left because of it… Does this make me part of the cult that believes this staff is our best option to beat psu I guess so.
1. Yep fire a 3 time champ and gold medal winner obviously knows nothing about wrestling. Oh wait fire Terry who has a few medals himself and actually coached a few that have won a few medals as well. Fire M* yep fire the guy that convinced guys like Young, Kemdawg, Marinelli, PK, Chittum, etc to come to Iowa. Fire Telford look were Nelson finished the year, got Warner to the finals and to AA in probably the 2nd toughest weight in the country and done some really nice things with a bit of a undersized and not the most athletic hwt in Cass. Remember how Carl couldn’t beat at isu and left because of it… Does this make me part of the cult that believes this staff is our best option to beat psu I guess so.
I’m certainly not on the fire brands and wagon at all despite the title of thread. But same formula will continue to yield same result. Every coach has positive attributes its weak not to weigh them and see that we could do much better in upper weights. Great recruiter poor development:/ (our upper weight coaches)
Alabama football had a rough go of it the last couple years in football. Saban didn’t act like a sissy and cling to coaches that weren’t producing because of being friends or former players. He moved on and brought it some new guys. Why? Because he’s paid to win titles.
A critic is going to look at that list and note that your examples of success do not include a single champion. I think the unrest is based primarily on relative lack of champions.
37-4 the last three years doesn’t sound like a rough go to me but at Alabama if you don’t win a National Championship that does.
Correct - there are 70 plus teams that secretly wish they were Iowa. All but one.
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