Florida Duals
- Thread starter UndercoverHawk
- Start date
Spencer Lee didn't even compete for a Senior World Team while Kyle won a World Gold Medal. They aren't even close. Gable, Kyle, and J'den had more success than Spencer Lee at the same age.
For some reason, Iowa has basically abandoned competing for Junior/Senior World Teams. I've never heard a good explanation, but whatever. I'm sure y'all will make excuses.
I appreciate your facts, I really do! However, my apologies for not articulating it better... I was trying to point out nobody has blown him out of the water in points. His loses haven't been by 10 points. I don't recall him wrestling to IMar, so great memory on that as well!
No. I went to Harvard, graduated when I was 16 and made millions early so I could day drink whenever I wanted to.
I've got one Cornell grad detailing my yacht and another refilling my drink as I type this. Life is good.
His memory has nothing to do with it, I can 100% assure you of that.
Aren’t I foolish. Dang. I just didn’t look in the dictionary first. I didnt know to be technically and mentally advanced as a true freshman that one had to compete for senior world medals.
Also I could have sworn we were talking about where these athletes were as true freshman...not later. There are no wrestlers more accomplished, technically advanced, or mentally advanced than Spencer coming out of high school. Argue accomplishments after if you wish but there are no more advanced wrestlers at that stage and only a few that can be mentioned in that category.
Kyle was. It's not even up for debate. That's why he was the youngest World Gold and Olympic Gold medalist in USA HISTORY. Gable likely was too. Maybe a smidge underdeveloped from a physical standpoint, but clearly there technically and mentally with Spencer. At 20-years-old he was already the best in the world in a grown man weight division.
From a mental standpoint, I agree that Spencer is as elite as we have seen in a long time. From a physical standpoint, he was coming off a blown knee injury that has persisted throughout his college career. Clearly, Spencer's body has broken down over the course of his college career.
Spencer reminds me of Grant Hill. An exceptionally talented athlete that was betrayed by his body and never could match his college accolades with his professional career.
To wrestle at an international level, Spencer will need to fix both ACLs. That's a 14-18 month recovery starting in April 2022. So best-case scenario he is ready to compete for the 2024 Olympic trials.
Ohhh so weight class makes a difference if you are “Grown” man or not you just lost all credibility, there are Oly and world champs at 57kg surprised you did not know this.
And Spencer isn't one of them. I get it, y'all worship the guy.
But clearly, his body has let him down. That's no fault of his, but it's reality. It's why I doubt we see Spencer before mid-January. I personally would pack him in ice and wrestle a couple of duals in February to knock the rust off then go straight into B1G Ten Championship.
He has zero ACL's and now he has Nick Suriano in his weight class.
He is a multiple time age level world champ, you wish you had someone like Lee to worship and You underestimate the powers of the dark side, Spencer welcomes NS
No memory on my part. Wrestlestats has everyone's record.
Of course Marinelli doesn't get blown out by anyone. He is really good, and really good wrestlers are typically in every match barring unforeseen circumstances.
O’Toole is an absolutely incredible wrestler and as @1stplacehawk mentioned, quite possibly the worst style match up for Alex yet. Some of you aren’t giving him near the respect he deserves. Kid is awesome in every position.
Guys, there is a reason I've had Mizzoufan on ignore for a very long time. He's obviously a 12-year old that never heard of Cael Sanderson, Ed Banach, Dave Schultz, Lincoln McIlravy or many others who were more accomplished as Freshman than Mr, Snyder, who couldn't win at 197 as a Freshman, so he moved up to a weight class where he was faster than all the opponents he faced. Maybe he was cutting too much to be effective at 197, I don't know. I'll give him (Mizzou) that Snyder turned into a world-beater at a younger age than many, but a lot of things factored into his early world titles. I'll grant you, he has had more international success than all but a handful of U.S. wrestlers, but he was not that great as a college Freshman. I'll wait until O'Toole survives a whole year of DI competition before I crown him the GOAT. I have seen too many Tigers that could go with anyone on a given day and lose to a nobody the next. I've also seen a great majority of them choke at the big dance.
P.S. from what I've seen so far, NothingMeaninful is just what his name implies and is headed for the ignore list too, unless he surprises me. He might also be a pre-teen.
P.S. from what I've seen so far, NothingMeaninful is just what his name implies and is headed for the ignore list too, unless he surprises me. He might also be a pre-teen.
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I’m afraid O’Toole isn’t one of those. The young man is just built different…. Technically, physically, and mentally.
I have to agree that O'Toole will be the Bulls biggest hurdle this year. I would actually not mind it if they didn't meet until NCAAs. I like Alex in the 1st meeting, but O'Toole will be tough to beat twice. Time will tell.
I know he is very good but maybe I have missed something that is telling you guys he is a matchup nightmare for Bull, what are his best matches to date that make you guys believe he is a world beater? I’m going to need to go back and watch them to see what you guys are thinking.
I'm willing to put $50 on the line to the HWC saying that they don't lose more than 3 weights if we start the team we put on the floor against ISU. I realize you used the term, conceivably, which covers all matters of possibilities, but I just don't see more than 3 losses.
Wick looked really good against Griffith...it wasn't close. The man has clearly been staying rust-free...at least as I saw from that match.
My friend, look at the wrestlers Lee dominated to win the NCAAs as a freshmen...and then go from there. And please don't hold Lee down because his knees were injured; if Kyle. J'den or Gable were in the same boat they wouldn't have won the gold medals you are discussing. Lee will go down as one of the greatest college wrestlers regardless of what he may or may not do at the professional level. Spencer's not even close, huh? Do any of those folks you mentioned have more NCAA championships than Spencer Lee? Um, no. I'm good with most comparisons, but please...let's not be silly...
I agree with some of what you said, but what do you mean Snyder wasn't great his freshman year?
He had 5 loses, all of which were to All-Americans.
On the way to the finals he even knocked off the returning national champ J'Den Cox.
Also, he couldn't win at 197 so he moved up? What? The only person Snyder couldn't solve was Gadson, who graduated following that unbelievable pin in the finals.
More proof that I'm getting old. I forgot that he made the finals that year. I mainly remember the 5 losses. I don't think he would have beaten J'Den again, but we'll never know. I remember thinking at the time that he was wrestling out his rear, but I guess he proved the next few years that it wasn't a fluke. Still not in the best five Freshman seasons in modern times.
You weren’t talking about what they did their sophomore year or later. Entering college no one is above what Spencer brought to the table in terms of hardware, technical ability, or mental fortitude. It’s really not debatable....but here we are.
I can get behind that final sentence, old tymer.
But if he had beaten Gadson, then maybe he's in the convo.
Either way, I thought it was an incredible run for a true freshman. Throughout the course of the season he knocked of 4 or 5 future AA's and some of them multiple times.
Imar has to be included, if not #1. Perfect record, good bonus%. I would probably add J'den Cox as well.
Lol I thought of Imar when thinking of Nolf and forgot to think about him for this list *facepalm*
3/5 were redshirt freshmen. They do not count.
True freshman, not guys that spent a year in a college room getting stronger and better.
Here are the recent TRUE FRESHMAN champs off the top of my head.
AJ Ferrari
J'den Cox
Spencer Lee
Yianni D
Mark Hall
Myles Martin
Of all of those guys, Yianni D had the most successful true freshman season. Yianni lost once on a fluke cradle by Eierman, which he avenged in the Semis of NCAA tournament.
Ferrari and Mark Hall also had special seasons with only 1 loss recorded.
Cox, Lee, and Martin all had multiple losses their true freshman year.
I'd probably put Mark Hall over Nolf simply because Hall won it all.
Plus Hall beat Zahid their RSFR year.
I think Nato, Myles Martin, and Imar also need to be considered.
Read me the rules that say redshirts don’t count. Also not sure what you’re smoking. Mark Hall had 3 losses and was gifted the match against Zahid.
Interesting. You think that DT's one loss and 2nd place at NCAAs outranks Dake's two losses and an NCAA title? Was Cael before "modern times?"
Honestly don't know: who in the above list was a true freshman? Yianni and Spencer, for sure.
@mizzoufan90
O.t. but that VT/Mizzou dual was damn good entertainment. I know that it didn't end the way you probably wanted, but a great dual for the fans. If anyone has ESPN+ and hasn't watched this yet, I highly recommend it!
O.t. but that VT/Mizzou dual was damn good entertainment. I know that it didn't end the way you probably wanted, but a great dual for the fans. If anyone has ESPN+ and hasn't watched this yet, I highly recommend it!
Didn’t know it had to be true freshmen. Also the “modern times” is arbitrary. DT was 2011 and that seemed like a good cut off. And I would say his season was better than Dakes. I also think Spencer’s 2 loss season was better than Dakes.
Spencer Lee came off major knee surgery. Had a huge brace on his knee. Did not take it off till B1Gs or NCAAs? Then piss pounded everyone in his path in what was most likely a much tougher bracket then any of these guys had!
I bet it wasn’t a fluke cradle when Eierman was at Missouri
