*****Official Cubs 2019 thread*****

[mthawkeyes]

You pick out a selective time frame to make a very weak point. LOfreakingL.

One year doesn't mean anything to baseball executives and knowledgeable fans. I wouldn't want either Strop or Morrow anywhere near a Yankee bullpen.

I'm asking you nicely... try again?

In arguing that Strop doesn't suck, I will use the selective time frame of 2013 (when he was acquired by the Cubs) to present.
2013 2.83
2014 2.21
2015 2.91
2016 2.85
2017 2.83
2018 2.26
2019 5.06 (it was 2.53 before his last outing when he went on the IL).

I apologize for the small sample size, but based on these numbers a bullpen full of Pedro Strops would consistently be one of the best in baseball.

 

[dgordo]

 

[MitchLL]

When is the cut off for determining ‘failed starter’? A? AA? College? It would help clarify the situation. It was interesting to listen to the national broadcasters take shots at the overall quality of the American League last night.

AL is definitely top heavy. No argument from me. I'm actually excited, as a NYY fan, to see what happens when they get guys back. 6 of the 10 projected opening day starters, including pitcher and DH, have spent most or all of the season on injured list.

Right now, I'd say, the top teams in MLB are Houston/TB/LAD/Minnesota/NYY. Would you agree?

 

[MitchLL]

Or people should pay attention. The nets are excessive as they are.

What do you think the attention span of a kid sitting in those seats closest to the field might be? When we used to take our girls to games... all they cared about was running to the concession stand.

I think some of the decision makers think extending the netting might reduce demand for the most expensive seats because it might reduce interaction with the players.

 

[hawkifann]

When is the cut off for determining ‘failed starter’? A? AA? College? It would help clarify the situation. It was interesting to listen to the national broadcasters take shots at the overall quality of the American League last night.

The AL is so polarized. The Astros are a straight-up legit great team. They are talented and deep. Red Sox and Yankees are very good, bordering on being as good as the Astros when healthy and playing to potential and the Rays are just a half-step behind. I'm not sure Minnesota is "great" yet, but they are certainly capitalizing on a craptastic division.

In the NL, the Dodgers are the cream of the crop right now, but the Cubs, Brewers and Phils aren't far off. One big difference between the two leagues right now is just how horrendous the bottom half of the AL is. The Orioles, Jays, Tigers and Royals are really not even trying right now and the Mariners are 9-32 since a torrid 13-2 start. In the NL, there are really only 2 putrid teams - Miami and SF. The NL West has 4 teams at or above .500. The last-place Reds are 4 games under and wouldn't be in last place in any other division in baseball. The Yankees, Rays and Sox all get 35+ games against the Os and Jays. The Twins get 35+ games against the Tigers & Royals. No division contender in the NL has that luxury.

 

[HawkRugged17]

AL is definitely top heavy. No argument from me. I'm actually excited, as a NYY fan, to see what happens when they get guys back. 6 of the 10 projected opening day starters, including pitcher and DH, have spent most or all of the season on injured list.

Right now, I'd say, the top teams in MLB are Houston/TB/LAD/Minnesota/NYY. Would you agree?

No team has had more injury issue than the Yankees. As someone once said, 'Bad luck and injuries are a part of baseball'.

Yankees have played the Orioles (12 games) and the Royals (7 games) for about 1/3 of their games so far (19 out of 55). However, let's see what happens when their schedule gets a wee bit tougher. I mean after 4 with Boston, they have that rough stretch of TOR, CLE, Mets, and White Sox. Never mind.

 

[MitchLL]

No team has had more injury issue than the Yankees. As someone once said, 'Bad luck and injuries are a part of baseball'.

Yankees have played the Orioles (12 games) and the Royals (7 games) for about 1/3 of their games so far (19 out of 55). However, let's see what happens when their schedule gets a wee bit tougher. I mean after 4 with Boston, they have that rough stretch of TOR, CLE, Mets, and White Sox. Never mind.

Brett Boone might be the front runner for Manager of the Year. Maddon might be the front runner for the "doing the least with the most". He's taken a good team and made them average.

 

[dgordo]

Brett Boone might be the front runner for Manager of the Year. Maddon might be the front runner for the "doing the least wih the most".

Weird because you keep telling us the cubs have no one any good.

 

[MitchLL]

Weird because you keep telling us the cubs have no one any good.

I told you before, but you must have been busy checking Strop's ERA.

Cubs had a good team in 2016, in spite of Maddon, not because of him. Right now, the only decent players in Wrigleyville are Hendricks/Rizzo/KB/Baez/Contreras. It's a good enough team to win a weak division. So I fully expect them to make the playoffs, but a team with 88-90 wins is hardly elite. They COULD hit 92 wins, but I have my doubts.

Cubs fans have seemingly given Einstein/Joe a pass. A once in a lifetime WS title seems to be enough.

But Theo needs to quit dicking around and improve the bullpen. Bottom line.

 

[HawkRugged17]

Brett Boone might be the front runner for Manager of the Year. Maddon might be the front runner for the "doing the least with the most". He's taken a good team and made them average.

Brett Boone? Do you actually watch the Yankees?

 

[MitchLL]

Brett Boone? Do you actually watch the Yankees?

That was based on where he has them based on the AAA lineup they've had for much of the season.

Prove me wrong.

Yankees mgmt has aimed at putting a competitive lineup on the field because of the entertainment competition n New York. That has required signing FAs and trading future stars for present ones. Expectations are higher in NY than Chicago. That's hardly debatable.

Maddon is in a good situation. Fans continually makes excuses when the Cubs struggle. There's a good reason he left the AL East to go to the NL Central.

 

[dgordo]

That was based on where he has them based on the AAA lineup they've had for much of the season.

Prove me wrong.

Yankees mgmt has aimed at putting a competitive lineup on the field because of the entertainment competition n New York. That has required signing FAs and trading future stars for present ones. Expectations are higher in NY than Chicago. That's hardly debatable.

Maddon is in a good situation. Fans continually makes excuses when the Cubs struggle. There's a good reason he left the AL East to go to the NL Central.

come on, the yankees manager is not brett boone. and you want to lecture us about knowing nothing about baseball?

 

[MitchLL]

come on, the yankees manager is not brett boone. and you want to lecture us about knowing nothing about baseball?

Big brain fart. Aaron. Thinking of his old man.

 

[HawkRugged17]

come on, the yankees manager is not brett boone. and you want to lecture us about knowing nothing about baseball?

 

[HawkRugged17]

Big brain fart. Aaron. Thinking of his old man.

0 for 2. His old man is Bob. Brett is his brother.

 

[MitchLL]

0 for 2. His old man is Bob. Brett is his brother.

Thanks! More coffee, please.

 

[HawkRugged17]

Thanks! More coffee, please.

And don't forget granddad, Ray, played in the majors as well.

 

[MitchLL]

And don't forget granddad, Ray, played in the majors as well.

And great, great, great granddad... Daniel!

 

[HawkRugged17]

And great, great, great granddad... Daniel!

Had a rifle for an arm.

 

[cidhawkeye]

I like how the conversation needed to be turned back around when the vaunted AL was shown to be wearing new clothes. Time to go back to Cub and Einstein bashing.

 

[CuttyDoesIt]

When is the cut off for determining ‘failed starter’? A? AA? College? It would help clarify the situation. It was interesting to listen to the national broadcasters take shots at the overall quality of the American League last night.

I think alot it has to do with the ability to develop the secondary pitches. Alot of people can get by with a fastball/slider in college and low minors. But can they develop effective change ups/sinkers/cutters/etc to go through the lineup multiple times

 

[CuttyDoesIt]

Brett Boone? Do you actually watch the Yankees?

He obviously meant Boone Myers is the manager of the yankees

 

[CuttyDoesIt]

Can you all just put Mitch on ignore. He doesnt even try to make sense in this thread. Guy is a clown

 

[MuscoHawk]

Right now, the only decent players in Wrigleyville are Hendricks/Rizzo/KB/Baez/Contreras.

Jon Lester is not even decent? Cole Hammels? Do you watch baseball?

 

[CuttyDoesIt]

Cubs sign carlos gonzalez to a minor league deal

 

[hawkfan0319]

Cubs sign carlos gonzalez to a minor league deal

https://www.cubsinsider.com/2019/05...es-star-carlos-gonzalez-to-minor-league-deal/

 

[HawkRugged17]

Jon Lester is not even decent? Cole Hammels? Do you watch baseball?

Well, they're no James Paxton.

 

[dgordo]

average

 

[MuscoHawk]

average

View embedded media

“Decent.”

 

[claykenny]

I've probably forgotten more about baseball than you'll ever know.

Link that says the vast majority of closers are failed starting pitchers?

I'll hang up and listen. Stop pulling stupid shit out of your ass.

For someone with a self-proclaimed wealth of baseball knowledge, you sure are ignorant.

If you can start, you start. If you can't, you end up in the bullpen. If you're the cream-of-the-crop in the bullpen, you close. There's various reasons why guys can't start but can thrive as a closer, but the most common are limited repertoire and injury/durability.

What's more valuable? Getting 200+ innings out of Max Scherzer or 60-80 innings out of Max Scherzer? That's not a hard question to answer.

Go ahead and give me a list of all the guys who were always closers. It's pretty short. I can think of Bruce Sutter, Huston Street, Craig Kimbrel, Troy Percival, Jeff Montgomery (kind of... tried to make him a starter in 1986-1987), Tom Henke, Drew Storen, Ken Giles, Armando Benitez, kind of Fernando Rodney, and kind of Kirby Yates.

A quick look through the top thirty save leaders in MLB history has 24 players who were initially starting pitchers. I'd consider 80% a vast majority.

 

[hawkifann]

https://www.cubsinsider.com/2019/05...es-star-carlos-gonzalez-to-minor-league-deal/

I like it. He's unlikely to find his old mojo, but he's basically a no-risk signing with decent potential upside. If they see something in him that they can fix or if there's some injury they feel they can wait out, maybe he'll find lightning in a bottle.

 

[claykenny]

When is the cut off for determining ‘failed starter’? A? AA? College? It would help clarify the situation. It was interesting to listen to the national broadcasters take shots at the overall quality of the American League last night.

In my opinion, every relief pitcher is a failed starter. If a pitcher could start, they would start. Those that can't end up in the bullpen. Whether that happens in college, the low minors, the high minors, or the majors is irrelevant.

 

[hawkifann]

In my opinion, every relief pitcher is a failed starter. If a pitcher could start, they would start. Those that can't end up in the bullpen. Whether that happens in college, the low minors, the high minors, or the majors is irrelevant.

Either were a failed starter or were never going to be a starter. If you throw 104 but can never develop a second pitch, you're going straight to the bullpen.

 

[cidhawkeye]

In my opinion, every relief pitcher is a failed starter. If a pitcher could start, they would start. Those that can't end up in the bullpen. Whether that happens in college, the low minors, the high minors, or the majors is irrelevant.

I don’t disagree, I was trying to get a poster that likes to flip flop a little to clarify their position.

 

[MitchLL]

Well, they're no James Paxton.

Good point. Lester/Hamels are 35/36. Pretty limited time left in those arms.

Paxton is 30. I take Paxton every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Having no DH in the NL might lengthen the two Cubs' career, but not by much.

And while the CarGo signing is pretty low risk, it kind of proves Einstein has faulty priorities.

 

[hawkifann]

Good point. Lester/Hamels are 35/36. Pretty limited time left in those arms.

Paxton is 30. I take Paxton every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Having no DH in the NL might lengthen the two Cubs' career, but not by much.

And while the CarGo signing is pretty low risk, it kind of proves Einstein has faulty priorities.

So...Hamels is up after this year and Lester is up after next year. The Cubs don't have a lot of future invested in those two.

As for CarGo, what priorities? Kimbrel isn't signing anywhere until the comp pick goes away and I don't think Theo is actively turning down trade meetings because he's devoting 24/7 to CarGo negotiations.

 

[lucas80]

I like it. He's unlikely to find his old mojo, but he's basically a no-risk signing with decent potential upside. If they see something in him that they can fix or if there's some injury they feel they can wait out, maybe he'll find lightning in a bottle.

Yes, but he hasn’t been terribly good for 3 seasons. I’m not sure we are talking about an injury, and if it’s a flaw, then plenty of people have had the chance to help him fix it.

 

[lucas80]

Pedro Strop had another flawless rehab appearance in AAA last night. Expect him to be on a flight to St. Louis today, and to be activated tomorrow.

 

[hawkifann]

Yes, but he hasn’t been terribly good for 3 seasons. I’m not sure we are talking about an injury, and if it’s a flaw, then plenty of people have had the chance to help him fix it.

I'm just saying I don't mind it as a no-risk pick-up. I assume he'd have to perform in the minors before even making the 40-man and would be looked at as nothing more than a depth bat unless he really makes a splash.

 

[claykenny]

I don't think Theo (or anyone) is expecting a sudden return to 4+ WAR production from Gonzalez.

But, in 2018, he was still posted a 1.7 WAR. He still hits righties well. He can play an average right field. He's a great clubhouse guy.

Beyond the three starting outfielders and Bryant, they have pretty slim pickings for outfield help. They currently have Adduci on the active roster, Happ and Zagunis on the 40-man, and Fields and Dewes in AAA. I guess I would prefer a healthy twilight of his career Carlos Gonzalez over any of those guys.