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Roco Welsh

MPPoster said:
This whole Rocco Welsh situation is the perfect example of why it's stupid to redshirt someone who is clearly the best option at his weight. All you're doing is throwing away a year you could've used him. You never know how long he's going to be here and assuming you'll get all 4 years eventually is foolish. Tom Ryan really screwed this up.

I hope all of you people who thought it was a good idea to redshirt Angelo Ferrari know what you asked for. He was clearly the best option at 184 but you think it'll be better to save that year on the back end in 2029. . . if he's still here. Good luck with that.
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Along that same line of thinking and another recent example, Gabe Arnold should have probably wrestled (rather than redshirting) last year when he was the best option as well. Fast forward to next year and he might be on the outside looking in and searching for another landing spot unless he can beat PK, which seems like is an uphill battle at this point.

Good news for Gabe is that he will have that extra year elsewhere, but Iowa could have benefitted from him in the lineup last year.
 
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MSU158 said:
It was a joke, hence the winky dude. I am not one to hurl accusations like that without proof. But, make no mistake, if it were true he most certainly could "whistle blow" without it really hurting him any. You could never prove exactly what he did to try to take any medals or championships away from him as a competitor and he could always play the card that he left because it made him uncomfortable and he coaches "above" that and actually benefit in a major way from the fallout inevitably getting names to OkState that would otherwise end up at PSU...

Again, I am not remotely saying it is true and this is mainly a joke to me, but, short of some incriminating video evidence, he could definitely cripple PSU with that kind of scandal and come out of it smelling like a rose..
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How do you keep people from say talking? All this takes is someone reaching out to someone else and how will you stop it. Mineo was talking a whole lot of stuff about this whole event but if true Taylor was ready to fly to see Welsh. This goes beyond normal recruiting rules basically are out of the window by now. People are worried about how a recruit is contacted? LOLOLOL NIL deals are being handed out now negotiated by the kid after he signs. we all know this.

What you have is three programs willing to throw money into the program and at the problem. Iowa, Ok St, PSU. Currently they're the most serious players. I doubt anyone else will sustain any long term serious effort. Notice how they're 2,1,3 in national titles. If you think in the terms of crime families fighting for territory, power and control or three huge corporation's fighting for the same you will understand it better.

Thinking about school pride and tradition is not a workable paradigm anymore. We just use that because of fandom. The business model is what is actually in place. Currently Taylor is desperately trying to catch up to Sanderson and Sanderson will fight him tooth and nail. Brands is in the mix also but if Taylor wins I think Iowa is in a less good place than if Sanderson holds at number. The boosters will get a little salty if Taylor is in the mix in say 3,4 years. If Brands keeps the Hawkeyes in the mix and neck and neck with Taylor I think Iowa will be in a very good place within that time frame.

These guys are all hyper competitive, it's going to be interesting going forward.
 
Going forward, there will be three huge dominating programs, Iowa, Oklahoma State, Penn State. I don’t know if any of these sports could survive on their own, but they have an administration and backers more than willing to give them all the finances they need to succeed.

Everyone else is just well showing up and hoping for the best. Nebraska? They’re not gonna cut it long-term. Neither will Cornell. Cornell’s hamstrung by that four year no red shirt rule.

It’s going to be the three big boys and they’re gonna be at the top every single year
 
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DeangeloVickers said:
Who said anything about tanking recruiting? He's going scorched earth on everyone and everything at this point including his own roster. He's recruiting over kids who made major life choices to attend psu and by all measurements have been successful. It's honestly worse than the old Nick Saban, "we're going to medically retire you" trick so he could pull the scholarship and give it to someone else.
And that's not even getting into the purported financial support to kids for the sole purpose of not transferring to certain schools. Screw him and anyone supporting this garbage.
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So if Cael is going ”scorched earth” against everyone, including his own roster, why have ALL of his starters and projected starters for next year remained in the room? Why have none of Cael’s #1 recruiting class of 2025 rescinded their commitment and decided to wrestle elsewhere? How does a world freestyle champion like Ono decided that he wants to learn folkstyle and wants to learn it from Cael? Maybe, and bear with me here, the type of wrestler Cael recruits or decides he wants to attend PSU or to transfer in to PSU, is confident in their abilities, is receptive to being coached, and believes, in the end, he’ll be “the man” at his weight class when all the dust has settled. They also tend to understand that if they can’t make the mat out of the Penn State room their aspirations as an NCAA champion are not going to be fulfilled. No wrestler is guaranteed a slot on Penn State’s starting line-up. They have to earn it, just like wrestlers everywhere. To assert that Cael & Co are doing wrong by their wrestlers flies in the face of the evidence.
 
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TwoJoints said:
So if Cael is going ”scorched earth” against everyone, including his own roster, why have ALL of his starters and projected starters for next year remained in the room? Why have none of Cael’s #1 recruiting class of 2025 rescinded their commitment and decided to wrestle elsewhere? How does a world freestyle champion like Ono decided that he wants to learn folkstyle and wants to learn it from Cael? Maybe, and bear with me here, the type of wrestler Cael recruits or decides he wants to attend PSU or to transfer in to PSU, is confident in their abilities, is receptive to being coached, and believes, in the end, he’ll be “the man” at his weight class when all the dust has settled. They also tend to understand that if they can’t make the mat out of the Penn State room their aspirations as an NCAA champion are not going to be fulfilled. No wrestler is guaranteed a slot on Penn State’s starting line-up. They have to earn it, just like wrestlers everywhere. To assert that Cael & Co are doing wrong by their wrestlers flies in the face of the evidence.
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Man, you guys just keep crawling out of musty corner of the basement.
Don't you have your own board and better things to do??
Blah, blah, blah, who F'ing cares...
 
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TwoJoints said:
So if Cael is going ”scorched earth” against everyone, including his own roster, why have ALL of his starters and projected starters for next year remained in the room? Why have none of Cael’s #1 recruiting class of 2025 rescinded their commitment and decided to wrestle elsewhere? How does a world freestyle champion like Ono decided that he wants to learn folkstyle and wants to learn it from Cael? Maybe, and bear with me here, the type of wrestler Cael recruits or decides he wants to attend PSU or to transfer in to PSU, is confident in their abilities, is receptive to being coached, and believes, in the end, he’ll be “the man” at his weight class when all the dust has settled. They also tend to understand that if they can’t make the mat out of the Penn State room their aspirations as an NCAA champion are not going to be fulfilled. No wrestler is guaranteed a slot on Penn State’s starting line-up. They have to earn it, just like wrestlers everywhere. To assert that Cael & Co are doing wrong by their wrestlers flies in the face of the evidence.
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Get back to us when this all shakes out regarding the current roster.
There's earning your spot, then there's recruiting over 2 time AAs and top 10 guys strictly bc he can.
If you think that's remotely good for the sport or good for the athletes you're lying to yourself.
 
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DeangeloVickers said:
Get back to us when this all shakes out regarding the current roster.
There's earning your spot, then there's recruiting over 2 time AAs and top 10 guys strictly bc he can.
If you think that's remotely good for the sport or good for the athletes you're lying to yourself.
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Deal!
 
DeangeloVickers said:
Who said anything about tanking recruiting? He's going scorched earth on everyone and everything at this point including his own roster. He's recruiting over kids who made major life choices to attend psu and by all measurements have been successful. It's honestly worse than the old Nick Saban, "we're going to medically retire you" trick so he could pull the scholarship and give it to someone else.
And that's not even getting into the purported financial support to kids for the sole purpose of not transferring to certain schools. Screw him and anyone supporting this garbage.
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Kids make decisions that they feel are in their best interest and coaches make decisions that they feel are in their best interest. Maybe it will come back to bite Cael and PSU in the ass, but don't hold your breath. Alabama and OSU recruits 5*s every year regardless of how many other 5* there are at the exact same position on the roster.

Under your line of reasoning, Buchanon should feel bad for the coaches at Wyoming and Oklahoma because he bolted. He made what he felt was the best decision for him and that's exactly what he should do.
 
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kjb32812 said:
Kids make decisions that they feel are in their best interest and coaches make decisions that they feel are in their best interest. Maybe it will come back to bite Cael and PSU in the ass, but don't hold your breath. Alabama and OSU recruits 5*s every year regardless of how many other 5* there are at the exact same position on the roster.

Under your line of reasoning, Buchanon should feel bad for the coaches at Wyoming and Oklahoma because he bolted. He made what he felt was the best decision for him and that's exactly what he should do.
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I think there's a difference between Buchanan leaving clearly weak programs AND in Iowa taking a multi time AA at a weight where they were clearly weak and what's taking place at PSU. Even at that Iowa still took big heat for their transfers.
Recruiting over AAs and high level recruits before they've hit the mat, and paying kids to stay away from competiting schools is not good for the sport. Period. End of story.
 
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DeangeloVickers said:
I think there's a difference between Buchanan leaving clearly weak programs AND in Iowa taking a multi time AA at a weight where they were clearly weak and what's taking place at PSU. Even at that Iowa still took big heat for their transfers.
Recruiting over AAs and high level recruits before they've hit the mat, and paying kids to stay away from competiting schools is not good for the sport. Period. End of story.
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Paying kids to not go to a school is ludicrous. I agree.

We can agree to disagree on everything else. Buchanon took someone else's spot that Iowa recruited, no? Even if he did, such is life. The good part is that the transfer portal now allows kids to move on if they get recruited over and not be penalized.

If those are weak programs, why did Buchanon commit to them to begin with?
 
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AndEEss said:
When has Cael benched a better wrestler in favor of a lesser one?
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You're assuming that Rocco is heads and shoulders better than Kharchla. I don't know that he is...at least enough to bench a former AA. Yea I get that Rocco was a finalist but the sky opened up for him in a weak bracket and he beat: Murphy(Campbell), Ruth (Illinois), and Wolak (Columbia) all in OT. 174 got a shit ton tougher this year. Tan Tom did him a favor because his $’ask is way lower if he wrestled this year at 174.

And I was referring to Cael gray shirting, red shirting guys that are really good. But I remember him sitting Nico and Zain plus the N Cubed freshman in 2015 to load up for a run.
 
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wrestleknownothing said:
I am very confused by the "pay to not go" idea. How would that even work?

A booster pays the athlete not to go to a certain school. The athlete cashes the check and goes to the school anyway (and bonus if he gets paid by the school he attends too). What recourse does the booster have? Is there a contract that can be enforced in court?

Alternatively, the booster says I will give you 10%, or 25%, or 50%, or whatever, up front and the rest when you do not graduate from that other school. The athlete cashes the upfront payment and goes to the school anyway. Again, what recourse?

Or, the booster says I will give you the money in a year, or four years, if you do not go to that school. Why does the athlete trust he will ever see that money? Is there a contract that he can attempt to enforce through the courts?

Any idea what the mechanism would be to enforce this a "do not go to that school" agreement?
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Uh oh this is gonna piss alot of people off. How dare you bring this kind of thought over here. Go back to your own board if you're gonna keep on posting things that make sense.
 
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Hawktu said:
Uh oh this is gonna piss alot of people off. How dare you bring this kind of thought over here. Go back to your own board if you're gonna keep on posting things that make sense.
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PSU donors gifted Northern Colorado and Nickerson a very large one time payment sum of money last year to their program so they could do some upgrades to their facility and have the $ to keep Alirez. This is a fact.
 
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Gobblin said:
PSU donors gifted Northern Colorado and Nickerson a very large one time payment sum of money last year to their program so they could do some upgrades to their facility and have the $ to keep Alirez. This is a fact.
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The brand new accounts showing up to hit the emoji button is equally, if not far more embarrassing than being so clueless about thier own program.
 
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kjb32812 said:
Paying kids to not go to a school is ludicrous. I agree.

We can agree to disagree on everything else. Buchanon took someone else's spot that Iowa recruited, no?
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Yes. Who'd been in the program 4 years, got his shot, and failed to place at nationals. This isn't an even remotely similar comparison and you know it. More importantly Cael does too, he just doesn't gaf.
 
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Gobblin said:
PSU donors gifted Northern Colorado and Nickerson a very large one time payment sum of money last year to their program so they could do some upgrades to their facility and have the $ to keep Alirez. This is a fact.
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That can’t be! Helping a small program improve facilities!? A definite way to kill the sport! How dare he!
 
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DeangeloVickers said:
Yes. Who'd been in the program 4 years, got his shot, and failed to place at nationals. This isn't an even remotely similar comparison and you know it. More importantly Cael does too, he just doesn't gaf.
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It's not remotely similar because it's PSU doing it and not Iowa. If they were able to recruit over kids, they absolutely would. That's Brands job...to get the best kids in the program to help Iowa win. Guess what will happen if he doesn't do that?
 
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kjb32812 said:
Paying kids to not go to a school is ludicrous. I agree.

We can agree to disagree on everything else. Buchanon took someone else's spot that Iowa recruited, no? Even if he did, such is life. The good part is that the transfer portal now allows kids to move on if they get recruited over and not be penalized.

If those are weak programs, why did Buchanon commit to them to begin with?
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Are you seriously comparing Buchanan who is a 4x AA and National Champ to Glazier who collectively went 2-4 in his two trips to the NCAA's?

That's a thin argument.
 
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Gobblin said:
PSU donors gifted Northern Colorado and Nickerson a very large one time payment sum of money last year to their program so they could do some upgrades to their facility and have the $ to keep Alirez. This is a fact.
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So Penn State is “ruining wrestling” by “allowing” one of its donors to financially contribute to a non-trophy program, enabling it to upgrade its facilities and, as you claim, have some $$ left over to retain the face of its program? Now THAT’S the mark of a program trying to grind weaker programs into dust! It’s unfortunate that the donor’s largesse had the indirect consequence of preventing your program from adding a 4th transfer to the Parco, Teemer, Buchanan trifecta.
 
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A Fist Full of Hawkeyes said:
Are you seriously comparing Buchanan who is a 4x AA and National Champ to Glazier who collectively went 2-4 in his two trips to the NCAA's?

That's a thin argument.
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No. I'm saying that a coach's job is to get the best kids he can to help his team win. A players job is to go to the place that best helps him accomplish his agenda, which could be winning, money, academics, or a combination of the three.
 
TwoJoints said:
So Penn State is “ruining wrestling” by “allowing” one of its donors to financially contribute to a non-trophy program, enabling it to upgrade its facilities and, as you claim, have some $$ left over to retain the face of its program? Now THAT’S the mark of a program trying to grind weaker programs into dust! It’s unfortunate that the donor’s largesse had the indirect consequence of preventing your program from adding a 4th transfer to the Parco, Teemer, Buchanan trifecta.
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Are you able to legally drive? If so, how do you do so with your head up your ass?

If you have Caels guys numbers, please send them a text and have them save Little Rock.
 
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DeangeloVickers said:
Get back to us when this all shakes out regarding the current roster.
There's earning your spot, then there's recruiting over 2 time AAs and top 10 guys strictly bc he can.
If you think that's remotely good for the sport or good for the athletes you're lying to yourself.
Click to expand...
He is not good for Iowa and okie st but he is good for happy valley. Make sure to let everyone know when an opposing coach is good for another team.
 
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