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Saudi blood money golf field announced

Barnstormers Hoops said:
PGA doesn’t run the PGA championship. Bet he plays. And now that players see Majors are available I bet you see more opt into where the big $$$ is. Don’t blame them at all. It’s a business decision. Our government does business with them and other shady characters. PGA has a history of exclusion. I don’t feel one bit sorry for them. If anything maybe the competition will improve the game, tournaments, etc.

I’ll close with I don’t approve of SA and the way the have operated and treated people, but I am not going to get mad about players making money playing a sport either.
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Now I believe "PGA, America" runs the PGA Championship....they are a separate organization from "PGA Tour" I believe....I think the two big money makers "PGA, America" has are the PGA Championship and the Ryder Cup...but it has been many years since I had an association with them.....and things change. Perhaps we have a member of "PGA, America" or "PGA Tour" here who knows???....PGA America primarily reps club professionals and their interests and PGA Tour reps tour players and their interests...
The PGA split up back in the 70's I think into two divisions.....a division for club pros and a separate division for tour players....
 
joelbc1 said:
Now I believe "PGA, America" runs the PGA Championship....they are a separate organization from "PGA Tour" I believe....I think the two big money makers "PGA, America" has are the PGA Championship and the Ryder Cup...but it has been many years since I had an association with them.....and things change. Perhaps we have a member of "PGA, America" or "PGA Tour" here who knows???....PGA America primarily reps club professionals and their interests and PGA Tour reps tour players and their interests...
The PGA split up back in the 70's I think into two divisions.....a division for club pros and a separate division for tour players....
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Your use of ellipses is less... than... amazing.
 
SeaPA said:
I don't see the PGA position as being vindictive, though I guess I could see it being somewhat insecure. I don't blame them for being concerned. There is most certainly potential for the Saudi money to essentially turn the PGA tour into a farm system for the LIV, where young players start on the PGA & jump to the LIV as soon as they make enough of a name to get a big money offer.
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If you're the lesser paying professional tour, aren't you the farm league by default?
 
joelbc1 said:
Now I believe "PGA, America" runs the PGA Championship....they are a separate organization from "PGA Tour" I believe....I think the two big money makers "PGA, America" has are the PGA Championship and the Ryder Cup...but it has been many years since I had an association with them.....and things change. Perhaps we have a member of "PGA, America" or "PGA Tour" here who knows???....PGA America primarily reps club professionals and their interests and PGA Tour reps tour players and their interests...
The PGA split up back in the 70's I think into two divisions.....a division for club pros and a separate division for tour players....
Click to expand...

I think the split started in the late 60s & was completed by the early 70s. Of course, it was mostly over money; Nicklaus & Palmer, along with a few others, were making the game popular, bringing in TV money, etc., and wanted to keep that TV money & spread it mostly among the tour players instead of it mostly going to PGA of America.
 
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seminole97 said:
If you're the lesser paying professional tour, aren't you the farm league by default?
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With the current player roster, I would disagree. The talent level on the PGA tour is vastly superior to the current Saudi roster. The field for the first LIV tournament is weaker than most PGA events.
 
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SeaPA said:
With the current player roster, I would disagree. The talent level on the PGA tour is vastly superior to the current Saudi roster. The field for the first LIV tournament is weaker than most PGA events.
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Be interesting how long that stays the case if that’s where the money is.

Has it been discussed how the field will be set in the years to come?
I assumed with the 8 and 9 figures being thrown around it was multi-year commitments, but presumably you want to be able to relegate the least talented for better talent when possible.
 
Barnstormers Hoops said:
Why does he have to have an issue with PGA? Sounds to me like he was approached about helping get the league going and accepted thinking it was a chance to create other options and events for professionals. Opportunity for players to make a lot of money. They tried to work around many PGA events, but also had some head to head weekends. I am guessing here… but if PGA had allowed players an exception or two each year to play in those head to head weeks this probably goes away. And, without coverage this would probably go away after 2-3 seasons. Now I bet SA loves the attention and drama and will be more willing to spend more and for much longer to make a go of this. I think you’ll see more players join them with majors now an option.

I’m curious to see the PGAs move. Do they have the ability to increase prize money, make any innovative changes to their events or coverage? Gonna be an interesting couple of years to see what ends up happening:
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Do some research. Norman has bitched about the PGA tour for years.
 
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Barnstormers Hoops said:
Why does he have to have an issue with PGA? Sounds to me like he was approached about helping get the league going and accepted thinking it was a chance to create other options and events for professionals. Opportunity for players to make a lot of money. They tried to work around many PGA events, but also had some head to head weekends. I am guessing here… but if PGA had allowed players an exception or two each year to play in those head to head weeks this probably goes away. And, without coverage this would probably go away after 2-3 seasons. Now I bet SA loves the attention and drama and will be more willing to spend more and for much longer to make a go of this. I think you’ll see more players join them with majors now an option.

I’m curious to see the PGAs move. Do they have the ability to increase prize money, make any innovative changes to their events or coverage? Gonna be an interesting couple of years to see what ends up happening:
Click to expand...

Scott559 said:
I guess I really don‘t get the outrage, Golfers doing business with the Saudis, So does the US Government, General Motors, Ford, Cocoa Cola, Pepsi, AT&T, Motorola, etc, etc. Why are professional golfers the line in the sand for so many? It has been no secret who the Saudis are and what they have done and the US and countless corporations have turned a blind eye for years because of money.
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If Norman and co want to promote a new golf league, that’s fine. But they don’t also need to defend the Saudi government as well.
 
joelbc1 said:
You can write off the PGA, as he has "resigned" from that organization today.....
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Um, no he didn't

Are the PGA Tour and the PGA of America different?​

Yes, the PGA Tour and the PGA of America have been independent of one another since 1968. The PGA Tour is an elite organization of tournament professionals, while the PGA of America is made up of club and teaching professionals who work at on- and off-course golf facilities around the country (and the world).

DJ is exempt for the 2023 and 2024 PGA and lifetime for the Masters

Phil has a lifetime exemption for the Masters and PGA

In regards to resignation

A resignation is also not permanent. At least in theory. The PGA Tour handbook states that a player who resigns his membership can apply for reinstatement after one full season. A player competing on a multi-year exemption—which includes Mickelson and Johnson—who resigns must also sit out a full season, but can rejoin the tour at the beginning of any season and would be entitled to the remainder of his exemption as though he had not resigned. Johnson, for example, is exempt through the 2025-26 season. Should he resign but decide he wants to rejoin, he would have to sit out the 2022-23 season but could apply to rejoin the tour for the 2023-24 season.
 
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Does anyone here remember how the American Football League got its start?
They paid Joe Willie an unheard of salary to get him signed and then they bid their time and caught their break. The Saudis are gonna force a “world wide golf tour” and that is gonna cost everyone more money ( sponsors, fans, networks)….but the Saudis have more than enough money to force the issue.
This is similar to a “hostile takeover” in the business world. What worries folks is the fact that the Saudis are as close to godless, immoral people as this world has ever known. The women’s tour will come out a distant second in this one. For those “corporatists” out here, they should be all smiles. Like most things in this world, money will ruin “the game”…
 
MikeyHawk said:
Um, no he didn't

Are the PGA Tour and the PGA of America different?​

Yes, the PGA Tour and the PGA of America have been independent of one another since 1968. The PGA Tour is an elite organization of tournament professionals, while the PGA of America is made up of club and teaching professionals who work at on- and off-course golf facilities around the country (and the world).

DJ is exempt for the 2023 and 2024 PGA and lifetime for the Masters

Phil has a lifetime exemption for the Masters and PGA

In regards to resignation

A resignation is also not permanent. At least in theory. The PGA Tour handbook states that a player who resigns his membership can apply for reinstatement after one full season. A player competing on a multi-year exemption—which includes Mickelson and Johnson—who resigns must also sit out a full season, but can rejoin the tour at the beginning of any season and would be entitled to the remainder of his exemption as though he had not resigned. Johnson, for example, is exempt through the 2025-26 season. Should he resign but decide he wants to rejoin, he would have to sit out the 2022-23 season but could apply to rejoin the tour for the 2023-24 season.
Click to expand...
The Masters is beholden to no one but themselves. They can “withdraw” an invitation/exemption at their will.
 
MikeyHawk said:
Um, no he didn't

Are the PGA Tour and the PGA of America different?​

Yes, the PGA Tour and the PGA of America have been independent of one another since 1968. The PGA Tour is an elite organization of tournament professionals, while the PGA of America is made up of club and teaching professionals who work at on- and off-course golf facilities around the country (and the world).

DJ is exempt for the 2023 and 2024 PGA and lifetime for the Masters

Phil has a lifetime exemption for the Masters and PGA

In regards to resignation

A resignation is also not permanent. At least in theory. The PGA Tour handbook states that a player who resigns his membership can apply for reinstatement after one full season. A player competing on a multi-year exemption—which includes Mickelson and Johnson—who resigns must also sit out a full season, but can rejoin the tour at the beginning of any season and would be entitled to the remainder of his exemption as though he had not resigned. Johnson, for example, is exempt through the 2025-26 season. Should he resign but decide he wants to rejoin, he would have to sit out the 2022-23 season but could apply to rejoin the tour for the 2023-24 season.
Click to expand...
Well if he didn’t “resign” the Golf Channel got it wrong. His resignation in theory, would make it easier for him to re-apply for Tour membership if he deems it necessary, according to GC reporters today. By resigning today from The Tour, he will not be in conflict with the agreement he signed with The Tour not to compete against them.
 
joelbc1 said:
Well if he didn’t “resign” the Golf Channel got it wrong. His resignation in theory, would make it easier for him to re-apply for Tour membership if he deems it necessary, according to GC reporters today. By resigning today from The Tour, he will not be in conflict with the agreement he signed with The Tour not to compete against them.
Click to expand...
The summary posted from Golf Digest discusses that, DJ and Phil have multi year exemptions for the tour, could be eligible for reinstatement in the 2023-2024 PGA Tour season

Also, in regards to Sponsor invites

Non-major, non-FedEx Cup playoff events offer sponsor’s invitations to a few hand-selected players. The PGA Tour has a rule that some of the sponsor’s invites must be given to full members of the tour who did not get into the event on their priority number, but there are “unrestricted” sponsor’s invites that can go to any player. Johnson, for example, is listed in the field for the Travelers Championship the week after the U.S. Open. Theoretically, he could be given a sponsor’s exemption from the tournament itself. The PGA Tour declined to comment on that possibility.
 
joelbc1 said:
Does anyone here remember how the American Football League got its start?
They paid Joe Willie an unheard of salary to get him signed and then they bid their time and caught their break. The Saudis are gonna force a “world wide golf tour” and that is gonna cost everyone more money ( sponsors, fans, networks)….but the Saudis have more than enough money to force the issue.
This is similar to a “hostile takeover” in the business world. What worries folks is the fact that the Saudis are as close to godless, immoral people as this world has ever known. The women’s tour will come out a distant second in this one. For those “corporatists” out here, they should be all smiles. Like most things in this world, money will ruin “the game”…
Click to expand...

The question is if LIV goes the route of the AFL or the USFL.
 
jamesvanderwulf said:
All I know is if any of LIV guys end up playing again in the US, instead of screaming " get in the hole ", all the golf bros need to yell out " KASHOGGI! " on their every drive...
Click to expand...

The LIV tour isn’t exclusively overseas.

Half of the events are here in US
 
sober_teacher said:
The question is if LIV goes the route of the AFL or the USFL.
Click to expand...
THAT is the question......Will they fold (USFL) or will they get a few new international "tour stops" open to ALL professional golfers (AFL).......hostile take-over....or a form of "merger"? It might be a way to get Trump involved in professional golf.....
(Trump's Turnberry Golf Links is one of the great golf courses in the world. However, Trump has pissed off the Scots with his shady business dealings and The Royal and Ancient with his complete ignorance of golf traditionslack, the R and A removed Turnberry from its Open rotation until he sells the property.)
 
MikeyHawk said:
The summary posted from Golf Digest discusses that, DJ and Phil have multi year exemptions for the tour, could be eligible for reinstatement in the 2023-2024 PGA Tour season

Also, in regards to Sponsor invites

Non-major, non-FedEx Cup playoff events offer sponsor’s invitations to a few hand-selected players. The PGA Tour has a rule that some of the sponsor’s invites must be given to full members of the tour who did not get into the event on their priority number, but there are “unrestricted” sponsor’s invites that can go to any player. Johnson, for example, is listed in the field for the Travelers Championship the week after the U.S. Open. Theoretically, he could be given a sponsor’s exemption from the tournament itself. The PGA Tour declined to comment on that possibility.
Click to expand...
Do you think sponsors are lining up for Phillip now? Does he have any left? Phillip really played this thing poorly. He's the Pete Rose of golf tight now. He is a smart-ass who outsmarted himself and now everyone knows it.
DJ.....we will see. But it isn't his first being on the wrong side of the PGA, either. Cocaine and now this.....is it business or the prodigal son?
I am as curious as the next guy to see if it plays out in favor of the players or the business. There will still be great golf to watch.
 
Meh, I suspect this will be just more money tossed around by the richer than God Sauds because they can and I don’t think it will be around very long. No one’s going to watch this crap anyway unless the losers get buried up to their necks in the ground and the gallery gets to throw golf balls at their heads until they’re dead. It won’t be compelling golf and it will never have the Open, the Masters, the US Open nor the PGA. Disappointed that some of these players will whore themselves out for 30 pieces of silver but only a few of them are what I consider top tier players anyway. In 10 years no one will even remember the LIV, whatever that stands for.
 
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joelbc1 said:
The Masters is beholden to no one but themselves. They can “withdraw” an invitation/exemption at their will.
Click to expand...
joelbc1 said:
Well if he didn’t “resign” the Golf Channel got it wrong. His resignation in theory, would make it easier for him to re-apply for Tour membership if he deems it necessary, according to GC reporters today. By resigning today from The Tour, he will not be in conflict with the agreement he signed with The Tour not to compete against them.
Click to expand...

joelbc1 said:
THAT is the question......Will they fold (USFL) or will they get a few new international "tour stops" open to ALL professional golfers (AFL).......hostile take-over....or a form of "merger"? It might be a way to get Trump involved in professional golf.....
(Trump's Turnberry Golf Links is one of the great golf courses in the world. However, Trump has pissed off the Scots with his shady business dealings and The Royal and Ancient with his complete ignorance of golf traditionslack, the R and A removed Turnberry from its Open rotation until he sells the property.)
Click to expand...

joelbc1 said:
Do you think sponsors are lining up for Phillip now? Does he have any left? Phillip really played this thing poorly. He's the Pete Rose of golf tight now. He is a smart-ass who outsmarted himself and now everyone knows it.
DJ.....we will see. But it isn't his first being on the wrong side of the PGA, either. Cocaine and now this.....is it business or the prodigal son?
I am as curious as the next guy to see if it plays out in favor of the players or the business. There will still be great golf to watch.
Click to expand...
You are looking at this way too emotionally. It was a business decision for both the players and tour organizers. There is free movement between the PGS Tour and the European Tour now. It could very well end up being the same with the LIV Tour.
 
joelbc1 said:
Does anyone here remember how the American Football League got its start?
They paid Joe Willie an unheard of salary to get him signed and then they bid their time and caught their break. The Saudis are gonna force a “world wide golf tour” and that is gonna cost everyone more money ( sponsors, fans, networks)….but the Saudis have more than enough money to force the issue.
This is similar to a “hostile takeover” in the business world. What worries folks is the fact that the Saudis are as close to godless, immoral people as this world has ever known. The women’s tour will come out a distant second in this one. For those “corporatists” out here, they should be all smiles. Like most things in this world, money will ruin “the game”…
Click to expand...
Last night as I was working out at the gym I was watching coverage of this LIV news and then coverage of Deebo and the Niners where Deebo wants paid more money and then the next story was about some athlete wanting paid more money and then the next one was Kyler Murray and the Cardinals, you guessed it, pay me more money. NIL, pay me, pay me, frankly, F all these people, college and pro. Millions of dollars for playing a game. F all of them. These people are completely out of touch with what is going on with the average person. They don't deserve us watching them anymore (and paying their salaries).

Went to the driving range and decided I can still enjoy sports, just I am going to do more playing sports on my own and spend less time watching sports, and those that all they care about is the money, they are off the list.

Bryson, used to be my guy. F him too. He's dead to me now.
 
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