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Serious Nova v. Iowa game discussion

ncaaball4.6

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Feb 23, 2012
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the back and forth is fun. You guys have that clown pumping up Rutgers and Penn State that makes Nova fans laugh. We are all able to take shots at Temple which is always a good time.

But let's get on to the game analysis.

First, you will beat Temple. They aren't good. Their defensive numbers are only good because they play weak competition. They take care of the ball and work their possessions, but their offense is real weak. Their only positive is that they have managed to win their close games, so if it is a close game who knows. But you will win by double digits.

On to the Nova game:
Obviously if you guys are hitting your shots, you can beat anybody.
Same holds true for Nova. If our guys hit their shots, they can beat anybody.
If both teams are missing their shots, I think Nova has the advantage. Nova scores out of the transition and plays excellent defense and can find ways to win even if the shots are not falling.

I know we played a couple of years ago in Atlantis. Nova won. Iowa was hitting shots early, but then Nova hit them late was able to pull out the win. Not sure if that means anything for this game as we already know the team that hits the shots can win.

I think Nova fans like the draw for match up purposes. Not because your team is struggling, but just the composition of the team. Teams that give Nova a tough time are those who have a back court that can take care of the ball (Shabazz Napier and Cat Barber come to mind) with quick/big/athletic perimeter players who can jump out at Nova and then teams that hit the boards. The perception of Iowa (not sure if it is true) is that you are more like a Creighton style team, spread the floor and try to hit threes. Not overly athletic on the defensive end (in terms of quickness to get out, not in terms of physicality from your guys with size). Now that doesn't mean Nova will win, as Creighton has certainly had its moments against Nova when the threes drop, but I think most Nova fans prefer to match up with that type of team.

If any of you can provide a breakdown of your team, thank you...



Anyway, here is Nova's breakdown.
8 man rotation. Only one true big (Ochefu, who is hurt), with a more athletic back up big (Reynolds) a bunch of interchangeable forwards (Hart, Jenkins, Bridges), and a couple ball handlers (Archi, Brunson and Booth)

Offensively we spread the perimeter, put one guy in the paint (Ochefu or Reynolds), will dribble drive to create space, and move the ball around the three point line. We take a ton of threes. Most of them are open, but we aren't the best three point shooting team. The guards are pretty good and can beat guys off the bounce and get into the lane.

Defensively we start with the signature Jay Wright 1-2-2 "diamond" 3/4 court trapping pressure. Put a bigger guy out front (Bridges is perfect for the role). It's more of a slow down the other team, try to force bad passes, and limit the time for half court possession, than it is a Louisville or shaka smart style turnover frenzy focused press.

The half court defense is a lot of switching and trapping. Statistically it is one of the best defenses in the nation, but now and then it has some holes. Sometimes a team, like say Iowa with a real specialty in shooting, can expose the holes and take advantage of it. I think if you asked most Nova fans their biggest fear it would be that type of situation whereby our guys are just out of position and you guys are knocking down open looks.

Nova generally plays a small team, but they are athletic and aggressive and get at the boards hard.

Nova is the best foul shooting team in the nation.

The Players:

PG Archi. The senior leader. Real good assist to turnover ratio. Will take some threes (okay long ball shooter), takes some mid range shots, and can drive. But he is more of a play maker than a scorer.

PG2: Brunson. Starts along side Arch. #1 PG in the nation last year out of high school Chicago kid who opted to play for a mid-major instead of all the Big 10 schools that recruited him (joke for the guy who thinks Rutgers and Penn State are big time!!). He is not super athletic given all the hype, but he is solid. He has a nice shot, I think he is the second best shooter on the team. His game resembles Archi's in that he will take some 3's, take some mid-range, drive to the lane off the bounce, and has a good eye for kick outs for his teammate.

PG3: Booth. He comes off the bench. Nova usually has 2 of the 3 PGs on the floor at all times. Sophomore from Baltimore. Solid, but not spectacular player. Had a bit of a sophomore slump, but seemed to come along later in the year. Same style play as Archi and Brunson.

Wing Forward 1: Jenkins. Big Smooth has really come along. Junior from DC. Kid is shooting at a great clip these days. Would have been the Big East Tourney MVP if Nova could have pulled it off on Saturday. Struggled early in the year, but has found his stroke. Great shooter, offense derives from catching the ball in a good position on the perimeter. Has developed a bit of a create game, usually off a head fake. Has some size and isn't afraid to post up smaller defenders. Plays solid defense and rebounds well for his size.

Wing Forward 2: Hart. Junior from DC. One of the 15 finalists for the Wooden award and first team all big east. Plays the same position as Jenkins, and defensively is similar, but his offense is more slashing based, dribble drives, and transition points. Has a decent long ball shot. Very good defender and rebounder. There were talks about him as Big East POY and possible early NBA entry this year, but those talks have cooled.

Wing Forward 3. Bridges. Red Shirt freshman. NBA potential. Like a lighter version of Hart. Super athletic for his size. Plays a very similar role as Hart in that he slashes a lot from the perimeter and takes some threes. Plus defender who might be put on your big shooter a lot as he seems like a good match up for that type of defensive role. Plays the top of the 1-2-2 diamond when in the game.

Center 1: Ochefu. Senior from Baltimore. The big man is hobbling. Hasn't dunked the ball in two weeks. Huge question mark. He's a very good traditional center. The key to the 4 out 1 in offensive set and mans the paint on defense.

Center 2: Reynolds. Not a true center as he isn't that big, but Nova has often used undersized centers in the past (Dante Cunningham for example). Was a little used bench guy until conference play started and Ochefu went out with a concussion. Reynolds has really stepped it up the past two months. He is much more athletic than Ochefu, but much less of a traditional big man threat in the 4 out 1 in offensive set. Is able to hit the 15 footer more than Ochefu. Leaves a big hole defensively when he is in instead of Ochefu.


Sagarin has Nova as a 3 point favorite, which is a real nasty spread for a 2 seed in the second round. Usually want a team in the 5-9 pt range. Hopefully the recent Iowa swoon gets the spread back in that range.


by the way, our message board is vusports.com. Lots of action over there. We are infested with Temple trolls (wcburrsies is their leader) so should have some interesting banter over there this week. The Temple message are subscription/application only, so not much action on those.
 
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Iowa is going to worry about Temple first.

Seriously, no need.

Quenton DeCosey is a ball hog. He takes most of their shots. The other guys just stand around and watch.

They play okay defense, but usually rely on the other team missing shots or playing poorly than anything else.

Fran Dunphy has the worst NCAA Tournament record of all time for coaches with 10 or more games played.


Let's talk about Sunday's game instead!!
 
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Seriously, no need.

Quenton DeCosey is a ball hog. He takes most of their shots. The other guys just stand around and watch.

They play okay defense, but usually rely on the other team missing shots or playing poorly than anything else.

Fran Dunphy has the worst NCAA Tournament record of all time for coaches with 10 or more games played.


Let's talk about Sunday's game instead!!


Any idea what time we play?
 
The short answer is Iowa was a top 5 team in January. That team is nothing more than a fleeting memory now. Who knows. Iowa could get hot and go on an amazing run. But as of right now, there is no evidence of that. They are limping in to the tournament and limping in bad.
 
I

The Temple message are subscription/application only, so not much action on those.

That's so as to keep you and your legion of imaginary friends OUT. (By the way, Iowa fans. we;re taking bets on how long it takes for your board moderator to pull the plug on him. My pick was Wednesday.)
 
I think we seriously need to worry about Temple first.

Then, if we MANAGE to win that one, let's go out, have some fun, and let the chips fall where they may.
 
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Now I hope Villanova loses.

Because you were rooting for Villanova prior to this post? Sure.

Anyway, what's the best way to beat a Fran Dunphy coached team?
Show up

He earned the nickname Fran One & Donephy for a reason.
 
Get past Temple we'll be alright. Nova can't win 2nd round games.

Well, unless Nova is playing Fran Mcaffery. Then the Cats always win those second round games. Scottie Reynolds style.

By the way, what does it feel like to win a second round game? Since I'm a Nova fan I have never experienced it. And since Iowa obviously does it all the time, maybe you can tell me what it is like.
Thanks in advance.
 
Did you get an A for that report? I can't speak to the analysis, but the length alone should at least get you into the B range.

As others have noted, Iowa is hardly a sure thing against temple. I don't know what the line is, but taking temple and the points is probably a good bet.
IF the Hawks are are tougher birds of prey than the owls on Thursday, that's as far as they go.
 
Again,

IOWA IS PLAYING TEMPLE ON FRIDAY

Iowa wins that game by 7+.

Fran Mcaffery is no tournament hero, but Fran Dunphy is the losingest coach in NCAA Tournament history.
 
Iowa is going to worry about Temple first.

Perhaps Villanova should do the same. Their first game isn't a gimme. UNC Asheville did beat Georgetown in Washington earlier in their schedule as well as playing Tennessee very tough.
 
Not worried about UNC Ashville. I wouldn't mind if they made a game out of it to keep the kids focused. But nova will win that easy.

Nova hasn't dropped a game that they were double digit favorites in since November 2012. They generally have no problem taking care of business. It is the teams ranked in the 15-35 range that are more worrisome.
 
Not worried about UNC Ashville. I wouldn't mind if they made a game out of it to keep the kids focused. But nova will win that easy.

Nova hasn't dropped a game that they were double digit favorites in since November 2012. They generally have no problem taking care of business. It is the teams ranked in the 15-35 range that are more worrisome.

I hope your team feels the same way as you do (about winning it easily). I think that was part of Iowa's problem when they played Illinois in the B10 tournament. They were looking ahead to Purdue and forgot that they had to beat Illinois first.
 
I doubt they will look ahead. That's why they haven't lost to a double digit underdog since 2012. They are a focused group.

But as fans we can look ahead all we want.

And we already have back and forths with Temple fans all year. So now let's look ahead to Iowa.
 
You're not getting much response because most Iowa fans are pretty much fed up with this team.

They choke every opportunity they get.

If they win a game it pretty much has to be by double digits because if there is any question late they will turn the ball over, air ball shots and miss freethrows.

We could seriously lose to Temple if there is any sort of pressure at the end of the game. We could also easliy beat them by 30 if Jok and Uthoff are both hitting shots and playing with nothing to lose.

Uthoff is an all american who will often forget hes an all american, especially if you are physical with him, and Jok is one of the best shooters on the planet but also struggles to get open against physical D. If you give him space he can shoot off the bounce but if you get into him hes not nearly as effective getting to the rim. Both will take and make shots from 5 feet behind the 3pt line. Big ten teams have figured this out and will guard them out there, we may catch some less familiar opponents off guard.

Our two point guards that play mostly at the same time aren't very good. Every once in a while they will have a good game and thats when Iowa can beat anybody. Most of the time they just don't do much of anything and rarely look to shoot. Our center defends other bigs and rebounds really well but struggles to guard on the perimeter and finish anything but the easiest of layups.

Basically Iowa starts two exceptionally good offensive players and 3 really bad ones. If the other 3 do anything Iowa has a chance to win most games. They were epiclly bad against Illinois.
 
I doubt they will look ahead. That's why they haven't lost to a double digit underdog since 2012. They are a focused group.

But as fans we can look ahead all we want.

And we already have back and forths with Temple fans all year. So now let's look ahead to Iowa.

Keep looking ahead. I know as Iowa fans that we aren't looking past Temple and I know that our team isn't either. We are hoping to get past Temple into the 2nd round.
 
I think Iowa will beat the Owls to play Nova. Thanks for the detailed analysis.

To beat Iowa, you need to be physical with both Jarrod Uthoff (6-9 PF/SF with unlimited range, if not contested. All B1G and all B1G all-defensive team. Not just a shooter, and capable of scoring from anywhere on the court) and Peter Jok (6-6 Wing who is a great pure shooter, if allowed to shoot in rhythm, especially spotting up on the secondary break). If both Uthoff and Jok get into a rhythm offensively, Iowa is a very tough team to beat.

Iowa's other three starters are seniors, who are very good defenders, but are all limited offensively. Mike Gesell is the primary ball handler and is a good on-ball defender. He protects the ball well (very good assist/TO), but has limited driving ability and is not a great shooter. Anthony "Sapp" Clemmons starts at off guard, but is also a PG. Good tough defender, decent ball handler, but not a consistent shooter. Worst free throw shooter among the starters. Adam "Woody" Woodbury is a four-year starter at center. Good position defender, who has become a good effort rebounder. Pretty good passer, but not a good offensive player. Often misses bunnies at the rim.

Iowa's bench was surprisingly good for the first 2/3 of the season, but has struggled the past month. Dom Uhl is a 6-9 Soph PF/Center, who has great potential, but has struggled on both ends recently. Nicholas Baer is a 6-7 redshirt Frosh PF/SF who plays extremely smart BB. Needs to get stronger, but plays solid defense, rebounds, and can shoot from outside. Ahmad Wagner is a 6-7 freshman PF who is very athletic, rebounds, and plays solid defense. Can score around the basket, but very limited shooting range. Christian Williams is a 6-7 freshman PG/SG, who only got playing time the past couple of weeks. Extremely long and pretty athletic, but very limited experience running an offense. Can score on drives, but is a reluctant outside shooter. The lack of bench production is maybe the biggest reason for Iowa's struggles over the past month.

Overall, if Iowa is allowed to run its offense and flow, they can be extremely impressive offensively. Iowa switches defenses, using man, zone and 1-2-2 press. Teams have resorted to playing Uthoff and Jok tough, daring the other players to score. Iowa has had difficulty winning close games.
 
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You're not getting much response because most Iowa fans are pretty much fed up with this team.

They choke every opportunity they get.

If they win a game it pretty much has to be by double digits because if there is any question late they will turn the ball over, air ball shots and miss freethrows.

We could seriously lose to Temple if there is any sort of pressure at the end of the game. We could also easliy beat them by 30 if Jok and Uthoff are both hitting shots and playing with nothing to lose.

Uthoff is an all american who will often forget hes an all american, especially if you are physical with him, and Jok is one of the best shooters on the planet but also struggles to get open against physical D. If you give him space he can shoot off the bounce but if you get into him hes not nearly as effective getting to the rim. Both will take and make shots from 5 feet behind the 3pt line. Big ten teams have figured this out and will guard them out there, we may catch some less familiar opponents off guard.

Our two point guards that play mostly at the same time aren't very good. Every once in a while they will have a good game and thats when Iowa can beat anybody. Most of the time they just don't do much of anything and rarely look to shoot. Our center defends other bigs and rebounds really well but struggles to guard on the perimeter and finish anything but the easiest of layups.

Basically Iowa starts two exceptionally good offensive players and 3 really bad ones. If the other 3 do anything Iowa has a chance to win most games. They were epiclly bad against Illinois.

This is a really unfair and poor assessment of our team. Yes, we have played badly down the stretch but every game was one that was winnable. We have won a hell of a lot of road games this year and we are 4-0 against two of the top teams in our league. You don't accomplish this with two good players and 3 really bad players. Michigan State looked like shit earlier in the year and it looked like they were going to completely fold. Purdue didn't look like they were world beaters either early in the season. MSU and Purdue got it going (as they usually do) as the year went on and Valentine came back from his injury. We had a tremendously difficult schedule early to start the B10 season and Iowa was in peak performance to get off to a great start. Iowa could have peaked later in the season and then we wouldn't be talking about an NCAA tournament appearance.

We did win 6 straight games to end the B10 season last year to get into the tournament so to say that this team tanks every year is very unfair. Clemons and Gesell are not great shooters from outside but Clemons over the course of this year has made some really key outside shots during the great early stretch of games that we played as did Uhl and Baer. Defensively our guards are solid and they don't usually turn over the ball.

I believe and hope that this team comes out with the fire and aggressiveness that we have seen in the preseason and in the first half of the B10 season. We rebounded very well after our meltdown at ISU and hopefully we rebound again after the Illinois game. (We did by the way come back from an 11 point deficit with 3 minutes left against Illinois to have a chance to win or put the game in overtime.) That is not what I would call choking when our best player that night was on the bench with 5 fouls during this 3 minute stretch. 1 very good player and 4 very bad players (according to you) almost pulled the game out.
 
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This is a really unfair and poor assessment of our team. Yes, we have played badly down the stretch but every game was one that was winnable. We have won a hell of a lot of road games this year and we are 4-0 against two of the top teams in our league. You don't accomplish this with two good players and 3 really bad players. Michigan State looked like shit earlier in the year and it looked like they were going to completely fold. Purdue didn't look like they were world beaters either early in the season. MSU and Purdue got it going (as they usually do) as the year went on and Valentine came back from his injury. We had a tremendously difficult schedule early to start the B10 season and Iowa was in peak performance to get off to a great start. Iowa could have peaked later in the season and then we wouldn't be talking about an NCAA tournament appearance.

We did when 6 straight games to end the B10 season last year to get into the tournament so to say that this team tanks every year is very unfair. Clemons and Gesell are not great shooters from outside but Clemons over the course of this year has made some really key outside shots during the great early stretch of games that we played as did Uhl and Baer. Defensively our guards are solid and they don't usually turn over the ball.

I believe and hope that this team comes out with the fire and aggressiveness that we have seen in the preseason and in the first half of the B10 season. We rebounded very well after our meltdown at ISU and hopefully we rebound again after the Illinois game. (We did by the way come back from an 11 point deficit with 3 minutes left against Illinois to have a chance to win or put the game in overtime.) That is not what I would call choking when our best player that night was on the bench with 5 fouls during this 3 minute stretch. 1 very good player and 4 very bad players (according to you) almost pulled the game out.

I said they were really bad offensive players. They are really bad offensive players. They are good defenders though.

The come back against Illinios, and Indiana two games earlier, was mostly due to the bench, both times the seniors came back in and blew it at the end. Mike did D up Yogi Ferrle pretty well though.

I didn't include anything on the bench, when Dom Uhl, Nick Baer, Wagner and Williams are playing well we have a pretty good team but those 3 seniors have been a terrible liability on offense.
 
I said they were really bad offensive players. They are really bad offensive players. They are good defenders though.

The come back against Illinios, and Indiana two games earlier, was mostly due to the bench, both times the seniors came back in and blew it at the end. Mike did D up Yogi Ferrle pretty well though.

I didn't include anything on the bench, when Dom Uhl, Nick Baer, Wagner and Williams are playing well we have a pretty good team but those 3 seniors have been a terrible liability on offense.

They (the pg's) are not good offensive players when they don't have space to work with. Iowa needs to push the ball down the court and get open looks. When the other team slows their offense down then that is when Iowa has problems getting off decent shots. Earlier, Uhl was hitting threes from the top of the key and we seemed to be moving the ball really well. I think that we need to get the ball into Woody more so that he can use his skills as a passer to kick it out to the outside shooters with Baer, Jok, and Uthoff. I think that pace is really important for Iowa to get into a good offensive rhythm. Once they are in that rhythm they can put points up quickly and their defense starts to pick it up as well.
 
the back and forth is fun. You guys have that clown pumping up Rutgers and Penn State that makes Nova fans laugh. We are all able to take shots at Temple which is always a good time.

But let's get on to the game analysis.

First, you will beat Temple. They aren't good. Their defensive numbers are only good because they play weak competition. They take care of the ball and work their possessions, but their offense is real weak. Their only positive is that they have managed to win their close games, so if it is a close game who knows. But you will win by double digits.

On to the Nova game:
Obviously if you guys are hitting your shots, you can beat anybody.
Same holds true for Nova. If our guys hit their shots, they can beat anybody.
If both teams are missing their shots, I think Nova has the advantage. Nova scores out of the transition and plays excellent defense and can find ways to win even if the shots are not falling.

I know we played a couple of years ago in Atlantis. Nova won. Iowa was hitting shots early, but then Nova hit them late was able to pull out the win. Not sure if that means anything for this game as we already know the team that hits the shots can win.

I think Nova fans like the draw for match up purposes. Not because your team is struggling, but just the composition of the team. Teams that give Nova a tough time are those who have a back court that can take care of the ball (Shabazz Napier and Cat Barber come to mind) with quick/big/athletic perimeter players who can jump out at Nova and then teams that hit the boards. The perception of Iowa (not sure if it is true) is that you are more like a Creighton style team, spread the floor and try to hit threes. Not overly athletic on the defensive end (in terms of quickness to get out, not in terms of physicality from your guys with size). Now that doesn't mean Nova will win, as Creighton has certainly had its moments against Nova when the threes drop, but I think most Nova fans prefer to match up with that type of team.

If any of you can provide a breakdown of your team, thank you...



Anyway, here is Nova's breakdown.
8 man rotation. Only one true big (Ochefu, who is hurt), with a more athletic back up big (Reynolds) a bunch of interchangeable forwards (Hart, Jenkins, Bridges), and a couple ball handlers (Archi, Brunson and Booth)

Offensively we spread the perimeter, put one guy in the paint (Ochefu or Reynolds), will dribble drive to create space, and move the ball around the three point line. We take a ton of threes. Most of them are open, but we aren't the best three point shooting team. The guards are pretty good and can beat guys off the bounce and get into the lane.

Defensively we start with the signature Jay Wright 1-2-2 "diamond" 3/4 court trapping pressure. Put a bigger guy out front (Bridges is perfect for the role). It's more of a slow down the other team, try to force bad passes, and limit the time for half court possession, than it is a Louisville or shaka smart style turnover frenzy focused press.

The half court defense is a lot of switching and trapping. Statistically it is one of the best defenses in the nation, but now and then it has some holes. Sometimes a team, like say Iowa with a real specialty in shooting, can expose the holes and take advantage of it. I think if you asked most Nova fans their biggest fear it would be that type of situation whereby our guys are just out of position and you guys are knocking down open looks.

Nova generally plays a small team, but they are athletic and aggressive and get at the boards hard.

Nova is the best foul shooting team in the nation.

The Players:

PG Archi. The senior leader. Real good assist to turnover ratio. Will take some threes (okay long ball shooter), takes some mid range shots, and can drive. But he is more of a play maker than a scorer.

PG2: Brunson. Starts along side Arch. #1 PG in the nation last year out of high school Chicago kid who opted to play for a mid-major instead of all the Big 10 schools that recruited him (joke for the guy who thinks Rutgers and Penn State are big time!!). He is not super athletic given all the hype, but he is solid. He has a nice shot, I think he is the second best shooter on the team. His game resembles Archi's in that he will take some 3's, take some mid-range, drive to the lane off the bounce, and has a good eye for kick outs for his teammate.

PG3: Booth. He comes off the bench. Nova usually has 2 of the 3 PGs on the floor at all times. Sophomore from Baltimore. Solid, but not spectacular player. Had a bit of a sophomore slump, but seemed to come along later in the year. Same style play as Archi and Brunson.

Wing Forward 1: Jenkins. Big Smooth has really come along. Junior from DC. Kid is shooting at a great clip these days. Would have been the Big East Tourney MVP if Nova could have pulled it off on Saturday. Struggled early in the year, but has found his stroke. Great shooter, offense derives from catching the ball in a good position on the perimeter. Has developed a bit of a create game, usually off a head fake. Has some size and isn't afraid to post up smaller defenders. Plays solid defense and rebounds well for his size.

Wing Forward 2: Hart. Junior from DC. One of the 15 finalists for the Wooden award and first team all big east. Plays the same position as Jenkins, and defensively is similar, but his offense is more slashing based, dribble drives, and transition points. Has a decent long ball shot. Very good defender and rebounder. There were talks about him as Big East POY and possible early NBA entry this year, but those talks have cooled.

Wing Forward 3. Bridges. Red Shirt freshman. NBA potential. Like a lighter version of Hart. Super athletic for his size. Plays a very similar role as Hart in that he slashes a lot from the perimeter and takes some threes. Plus defender who might be put on your big shooter a lot as he seems like a good match up for that type of defensive role. Plays the top of the 1-2-2 diamond when in the game.

Center 1: Ochefu. Senior from Baltimore. The big man is hobbling. Hasn't dunked the ball in two weeks. Huge question mark. He's a very good traditional center. The key to the 4 out 1 in offensive set and mans the paint on defense.

Center 2: Reynolds. Not a true center as he isn't that big, but Nova has often used undersized centers in the past (Dante Cunningham for example). Was a little used bench guy until conference play started and Ochefu went out with a concussion. Reynolds has really stepped it up the past two months. He is much more athletic than Ochefu, but much less of a traditional big man threat in the 4 out 1 in offensive set. Is able to hit the 15 footer more than Ochefu. Leaves a big hole defensively when he is in instead of Ochefu.


Sagarin has Nova as a 3 point favorite, which is a real nasty spread for a 2 seed in the second round. Usually want a team in the 5-9 pt range. Hopefully the recent Iowa swoon gets the spread back in that range.


by the way, our message board is vusports.com. Lots of action over there. We are infested with Temple trolls (wcburrsies is their leader) so should have some interesting banter over there this week. The Temple message are subscription/application only, so not much action on those.

Drive down the lane and take it in from the baseline, Iowa does not defend this part of the game well at all...

Sounds like you have some finishers, shouldn't be a problem.
 
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