***NCAA CHAMPIONSHIPS SESSION II***

[MVPFAN]

We finally won an upset match--thank you, PK!

Re Teemer, I don't think it's one or the other (injury vs. mailing it in). Appears to be some of both. He got taken down because he wasn't moving his feet, not because there was pressure on his shoulder. Something deeper going on with him, inside his head. Maybe Gable could've figured him out.

Re Parco, major bummer.

Still a lot of good wrestling in the round, and hopefully to come.

Agree, Teemer obviously not 100% physically but also clear the he isn't mentally dialed in either. Some going through the motions out there.

 

[oldhawk56]

You are a liar. Iowa always ranks very high in high school performance. The universities are considered very solid.

Mmm.. not anymore. It's sad.
Ames High School ranked 494th nationally to claim the top spot among Iowa schools. Iowa City West finished second among Iowa schools, ranking 509th nationally. The Trojans also finished second in 2019.Apr 30, 2020

 

[js8793]

Warner is one of the success stories of a 6th year.

My simple point was the body doesn't hold up for D1 training for that long. That's also something that would take some time to figure out, being this is uncharted territory for the new length of NCAA careers. I wasn't specifically blaming Iowa, but using them as an example since this is an Iowa page. Eierman, Teemer, and Parco spent almost all of their careers somewhere else.

Is he? It was his worst overall season of his career. Wasn’t even seeded in the top 12.

It is very clear that most guys start to fall off after their 4/5th year. That’s why the current model of paying 1 year mercenaries is so risky. Very rarely do they match past performance.

Franek went from 4th to 8th
Teemer went from 2nd to 0-2
Parco went from 5th to 1-2
Buchanan has a shot to be the exception

The staff should be identifying transfers with multiple years left. Those are the guys who typically produce. Desanto, Lugo, Caliendo, Eierman, Woods.

 

[Trapper85]

Warner is one of the success stories of a 6th year.

My simple point was the body doesn't hold up for D1 training for that long. That's also something that would take some time to figure out, being this is uncharted territory for the new length of NCAA careers. I wasn't specifically blaming Iowa, but using them as an example since this is an Iowa page. Eierman, Teemer, and Parco spent almost all of their careers somewhere else.

Probably some truth to your point - I mean, it's really true for about anything in life. The more you roll, twist, hammer, lift, etc, the more things CAN wear out, or simply more time for random 'accidents' to happen. But probably many other factors at play, and the individual's details matter (genetics, nutrition, training, mental sharpness). I think injuries can even happen more when you have guys that are not clean finishers (we've had our share) - they end up in too many bad situations. If you have lots of dominant studs, less likely to get injured when you are pummeling people.

 

[WrestleEveryDay]

DeSanto

DeSanto too dealt with that thumb/wrist issue all year long - Tom said it was more mentally bothering him than physically

Edit: Oh, Duh and Nelson Brands.

There is obviously something to 'not wanting' to rely on 6th/7th year guys. but this is all hindsight. We added Parco in the summer last year because we needed a 149. SB we added late in the summer b/c we needed a 197. JT came even later like August/Sept. We didn't have other options.

It is funny to me how everyone (particularly our own fans) complain about spending money on him. 1. it isn't your money. 2. If Bob Nichols and co. are shelling out this type of money that late in the off-season, it isn't like it is going to go somewhere else.

They are taking a shot - it didn't pay off. I'd rather them try than not.

Of course recruiting could/should be better, but when it doesn't pan out I'd rather pivot the way we did than stand pat and do nothing

You are correct about it all being hindsight, which is why I said it takes time to gather that data. The data is clear now. Think twice about recruiting 6th-7th year wrestlers.

 

[WrestleEveryDay]

Is he? It was his worst overall season of his career. Wasn’t even seeded in the top 12.

It is very clear that most guys start to fall off after their 4/5th year. That’s why the current model of paying 1 year mercenaries is so risky. Very rarely do they match past performance.

Franek went from 4th to 8th
Teemer went from 2nd to 0-2
Parco went from 5th to 1-2
Buchanan has a shot to be the exception

The staff should be identifying transfers with multiple years left. Those are the guys who typically produce. Desanto, Lugo, Caliendo, Eierman, Woods.

Agreed...except Eierman got injured in year 6.

You are correct about Warner. I confused his runner-up year with his final year.

 

[MSU158]

Is he? It was his worst overall season of his career. Wasn’t even seeded in the top 12.

It is very clear that most guys start to fall off after their 4/5th year. That’s why the current model of paying 1 year mercenaries is so risky. Very rarely do they match past performance.

Franek went from 4th to 8th
Teemer went from 2nd to 0-2
Parco went from 5th to 1-2
Buchanan has a shot to be the exception

The staff should be identifying transfers with multiple years left. Those are the guys who typically produce. Desanto, Lugo, Caliendo, Eierman, Woods.

Come on man, it's not like they are running around actively looking for only 6th or 7th year guys. They NEEDED guys at 149, 157 and 197 BADLY. These guys were inarguably vastly better than what Iowa had. On top of that, it is much easier to get guys to transfer that have already graduated.

Still, you aren't going to plan on major injury in their last year when they had wrestled every NCAA they could prior. I can't wait for the Covid effect to be over...

 

[IAcubbies]

I'll play devil's advocate (and catch a lot of hell for it, I'm sure). The problem, in my opinion, is that the body can't take 6-7 years of D1 wrestling training...for the most part. There are some big success stories, but here's my point.

KemDawg- 7th year senior. Did AA, but finished lower than the year before and had a major injury
Marinelli- 6th year senior. AA, but major injury
Jaydin Eierman- 6th year senior. Major injury and no AA.
Spencer Lee- Absolute stud. 6 years. Battled injuries throughout. Default to 6th.
Jacori Teemer- 6th year. 0-2. Injured all season.
Kyle Parco- 6th year. MFF. Major knee injury.

The body can't sustain itself for this type of training, for that long. It's not that the Hawks aren't getting guys that can't wrestle. They're putting guys on the mat with too many miles on them.

FWIW, I'm a big fan of every one of these wrestlers except Eierman.

Go ahead and light me up on my take.

Valid points. I was honestly thinking the same myself but wondering if it was an age/body thing or mentality/hunger.
But why the hate on Eierman? Haha

 

[js8793]

DeSanto

DeSanto too dealt with that thumb/wrist issue all year long - Tom said it was more mentally bothering him than physically

Edit: Oh, Duh and Nelson Brands.

There is obviously something to 'not wanting' to rely on 6th/7th year guys. but this is all hindsight. We added Parco in the summer last year because we needed a 149. SB we added late in the summer b/c we needed a 197. JT came even later like August/Sept. We didn't have other options.

It is funny to me how everyone (particularly our own fans) complain about spending money on him. 1. it isn't your money. 2. If Bob Nichols and co. are shelling out this type of money that late in the off-season, it isn't like it is going to go somewhere else.

They are taking a shot - it didn't pay off. I'd rather them try than not.

Of course recruiting could/should be better, but when it doesn't pan out I'd rather pivot the way we did than stand pat and do nothing

100%. I'm glad Bob shelled out the money for them. Under the circumstances, they were the right play.

However, some are trying to write this off as bad luck. It's not. It's bad process.

1. They failed to recruit and develop

2. So they had to go out and pay 1 year mercenaries, who are inherently more prone to injury and/or regression

3. And that's exactly what happened.

It all goes back to an original failure, the same failure that has hampered this program for 15 years. That's why many, including myself, are frustrated. The same problems keep happening.

Now, we'll see how the tournament finishes up. Hopefully, the remaining 6 make the stand with 2-3 in the finals and a champ. That would be a very solid performance.

 

[IRONBIRD]

Maybe develop some of the backups. Get a few matches. You say all this, and still wrestle most of your starters at Bellarmine lol. That wasn't even at Carver!!! Same with Wisconsin!! Pretty sure you didn't need Buchanan in those as an example you used.

Guys GUYS.... get you thinking caps ON!!!! READ everything I wrote NOT just a few lines!!!! It is THE WHOLE picture!!! How many matches came down to IOWA needing BUCHANAN to win for us to WIN this year alone!!!! How many times did we need SUPERMAN LEE to start us off when he was not 100%!?!?!?! How about when we sent STOLL out that time at home!!!!

Who else wrestles in a CYHAWK type dual???? Who else puts OK st on the schedule AND wrestles in the B1G????? IOWA is expected to WIN!!!! The FAN base comes out in FORCE to see GREAT wrestling!!!

I gave the NY YANKEE example. Do you know how many times MARIANO RIVERA was sent out to pitch the 8th AND the 9th!?!?!?

Do you understand the demand on these young men with media, fans, the schedule etc......

OK I am done TIME FOR WRESTLING!!!!

 

[js8793]

Come on man, it's not like they are running around actively looking for only 6th or 7th year guys. They NEEDED guys at 149, 157 and 197 BADLY. These guys were inarguably vastly better than what Iowa had. On top of that, it is much easier to get guys to transfer that have already graduated.

Still, you aren't going to plan on major injury in their last year when they had wrestled every NCAA they could prior. I can't wait for the Covid effect to be over...

See my most recent post. The fact they came into this year with 5 major holes in the lineup is the problem! They filled 3 of them with good transfers. 2/3 of those transfers did not match past performance, which is exactly what history told us would happen with 6/7th year guys.

 

[MSU158]

See my most recent post. The fact they came into this year with 5 major holes in the lineup is the probl
em! They filled 3 of them with good transfers. 2/3 of those transfers did not match past performance, which is exactly what history told us would happen with 6/7th year guys.

Welp, next year should have the best overall recruits in the room that Iowa has had in quite some time:

Deluca, Ayala, Kennedy, Arnold, Ferrari, Ludington and Kueter. On top of that, they will still have Caliendo. A year later, they will have Bassett and hopefully some combination of the Raneys and/or Moccos.

If that group doesn't produce 100+ NCAA points more than once by the time it is done, I will 100% agree that the Brands are the problem and Iowa should move on. Bookmark this and, if that doesn't happen, I will be happy to be the loudest person at that time calling for their removal

 

[WrestleEveryDay]

Valid points. I was honestly thinking the same myself but wondering if it was an age/body thing or mentality/hunger.
But why the hate on Eierman? Haha

Haven't been a fan of him since he was at MU. Too arrogant...amongst other stuff. As a Mizzou fan, I wasn't sad to see him leave. Lots of stuff I heard directly from MU wrestlers.