Who hates Iowa? Devyn Marble.

[Franisdaman]

I think Legend was on to something. You're a weird guy, Fran. I made my point and am not going to participate further. Quit tagging me. I do not care about the self-righteous drivel you continue to post. You're an idiot.

Funny how you bring up Legend. It was your crazy ass posts going after & tagging Legend that got you banned from this site. You just recently came back. You love tagging people & now you tell me not to tag you? LOL

Seriously, there is something very wrong with you. I am guessing you're bi polar because today you are waaaay off and way out there.

And actually, you have made several dumb ass points in this thread and everyone is laughing at you. But you're an idiot, so you are probably used to people laughing at you.

 

[Franisdaman]

this morning?

see, @BlackNGoldBleeder , we all think you are weird and an idiot.

 

[Franisdaman]

Soooo.... has Dev previously shared his disappointment with Fran? With Gary? With the U of I?
Or... just a random tweet knocking Iowa?

Seriously ... this is the good and bad about social media... So Dev sends a random message about displeasure (I’m guessing Iowa did not know about) and now the U of I is caught with its pants down trying to make good...

How about a direct conversation if you are upset ...

Instead... he chose the path of someone taking to a Facebook page to complain about your neighbor’s barking dog without ever approaching the neighbor first.

Loved watching Roy ... and Dev... Many know Roy’s off the court issues... Have a conversation with Barta and Fran... Find a solution...Talk... don’t tweet...

 

[NI hawk]

Kenny Arnold, Kevin Boyle, Steve Krafcisin, and Steve Waite all on that team, as well.

Frankly, the youth on the 1987 team is what hurt in the UNLV game. The young guys flat-out panicked, terrible ball control, and threw up some crazy shots they didn't need to take. But people also forget they still had a chance to tie that game late.

That afternoon after the game was terrible. I was in a bar in Orlando with my brother and we were totally deflated.

I couldn't watch sportscenter the next week in fear I might see highlights of the game.

 

[kceasthawk]

I think you could make an argument last year doesn’t count.

Are you serious here? They don't play the tourney so the season didn't happen? Cmon. You can be sure that all the stats that ALL the players accounted for last year will indeed COUNT.....

 

[Franisdaman]

I don’t know because I’m not involved in the interactions that may or may not have occurred between the Marble family and the university, which is exactly the point. Neither were you.

 

[unoHawkeye]

View embedded media

That is a great update, and I’m thrilled that the university is taking the initiative to reconcile. This doesn’t mean that Devyn was unjustified in feeling disrespected in the first place, even if it was a result of a miscommunication

 

[hawkedoff]

Maybe they weren't invited to the retirement of Lukas number? That would be embarrassing

 

[jonesy5960]

The 1980 team made the Final Four. Hard to call the 1986-87 team "better". Who knows how good 1980 team is with Lester for a full season and no injury against Louisville?

If Ronnie doesn't go down against Louisville they win the Natty. No doubt in my mind.

 

[LaTavianGreenshaw24]

WOB. So dumb to post this when everybody’s dog already knew this.

Smh. What a tool move.

Lol, just so “dumb” to post the truth. Maybe you just choose to ignore it.

 

[mtown66]

Well the way this is going to play out on the national stage is a black player who held the record for decades never had his number retired, even when he was gravely ill....meanwhile a white player breaks the record and gets his number retired before the season even ends.

you have to admit the optics are not great, especially given the summer Iowa sports had...

I call BS on this line of thinking. The difference between Luka and Roy is not just who scored more points or who was the better citizen although BOTH of those are clearly factors in getting a number retired. Dying early, although sad and tragic, is not a factor unless someone died heroically saving other's lives. Was Roy the POY in the Big Ten? Garza is one of just three players to win that award twice. The other 2 were Jim Jackson and Mateen Cleaves. Was Roy ever a consensus 1st Team All American once let alone twice? Not even close. Was Roy even an All American at Iowa? Never. Shouldn't that be a consideration to have a number retired? Was Roy ever even considered for national POY once let alone twice? That would be a no. Was Roy even the best player on his teams at Iowa? No, he wasn't. Did Roy ever put in the effort in the offseason that Luka did? Is that a trick question? I really don't think the Marble family should be wanting this discussion and I can not believe that Roy Jr. , who chose to go by a different name, was dumb enough to even broach the subject publicly. Luka accomplished so much that Marble did not that there should be no question about who deserved to have his number retired and color had nothing to do with this.

 

[Fan In Black]

Lester all time leading scorer. number retired
Stokes all time leading scorer. number retired
Marble all time leading scorer.
Garza all time leading scorer. number retired.

Dev is right.

 

[mtown66]

But Roy Marble was none of those. He was Iowa's leading scorer and a 3rd team all american. Luka will end up being a 2x 1st team all american, NPOY, all time leading scorer, and potentially top 5 all time scorer in the Big Ten

I don't think Roy was ever a 3rd team AA at Iowa. He was a 3rd team PARADE AA in high school his senior year. Roy wasn't even a first team All Big Ten player that I could find.

 

[mtown66]

Do whatever is necessary to make this right. Roy and Devyn were great Hawks and Roy should be honored.

Yeah, and while we are at it let's donate the University's entire endowment to BLM to make up for what you conceive as bad judgement by Iowa in their lack of providing recognition for Roy.

 

[83Hawk]

View embedded media

Barta has nothing to apologize for.

 

[chodehawk]

Barta apologizes to Marble family.

LOL. Here we go.

 

[Franisdaman]

Note that the families of Roy Marble, Murray Wier and Chuck Darling have all wanted numbers retired. Barta said that all three of them, through the university process, did not meet the criteria for retirement.

Story from Mike Hlas of the Gazette:


“We have learned since Sunday that Roy Marble’s family was hurt and feeling disrespected since that day,” Barta said Tuesday.

“I just want to take a moment and share that absolutely, that disrespect was unintentional and to publicly apologize for it. Fran (McCaffery) and I have also reached out to the family privately and shared those same feelings of apology. ... and also share with them some of the things that we’re working on and planning for moving forward.”

Barta said he had tried, but had been unsuccessful in directly reaching Devyn Marble as of Tuesday afternoon.

“When I arrived in 2006 there were three players who consistently came forward,” Barta said, “who were brought forward by fans and family members indicating that they should have their numbers or jerseys retired. And it was Roy Marble, Murray Wier and Chuck Darling.

“All three of those, through our university process, do not meet the criteria for those retirement requirements.”

Wier was a first-team All-American in 1948, Darling in 1952.

In 2015, Barta said, “I shared a vision that we have and continue to have to create a display in Carver-Hawkeye Arena when we renovate the concourse, to pay tribute to a lot of our greats including Roy and Murray and Chuck. We put a temporary display that’s still up there today, but we have not yet renovated the concourse, obviously.

“This spring and summer I’ll sit down with some of our former players, some of our longtime staff members, historians that have been around here a long time, and really go through and discuss and finalize how we can honor those three, and then make sure there’s not somebody else that we’re leaving out.”

Knowing Marble had cancer, Iowa held a halftime ceremony celebrating him at a Hawkeyes game in March 2015. Barta presented him with a framed Iowa jersey with his No. 23.

Marble’s teammate and classmate, B.J. Armstrong, had his No. 10 jersey retired in 1992 while he was a Chicago Bull, though the number remained in circulation. Chris Street’s No. 40 was the last number retired by the school, after he died in a 1993 automobile accident.

Armstrong and Marble were never first-team All-America or first-team All-Big Ten.

“I don’t envision retiring any more jerseys or numbers in any sports,” Barta said in 2015. “We haven’t done it in over 20 years. We’ve developed this wall of honor concept that we’re going to play out.”

Then came record-shattering Megan Gustafson in women’s basketball and Garza on the men’s team. Gustafson’s No. 10 was retired last January.

Gary Barta responds apologetically to hard feelings of Devyn Marble

A tweet from former Iowa men's basketball player Devyn Marble Monday night set off damage control in the UI athletics department Tuesday.

www.thegazette.com

 

[mtown66]

Mountain Man Hawk said:
I agree the number should have been retired. I understand the reasons it wasn’t retired back in 1985 but should all that have still been held against him in 2015 when we do the awkward half step of giving him a framed jersey? Someone said lots of schools have a requirement that you get your degree before retiring the number. If so, it would be interesting to see how common that requirement is.

It’s all just awkward because Roy was a fairly prominent figure again all the years his son was here, they showed his highlights in practically every game, they showed him in the stands in TV all the time, and then we have this weird policy where because of some off the court problems 30 years ago we don’t feel like we can really honor him with a retired jersey. If I was Dev I would think that’s messed up too.

If showing highlights is what it takes then Kenyon Murray should have his number retired, right?

 

[EagleHawk]

Lester all time leading scorer. number retired -2 time First team all american
Stokes all time leading scorer. number retired - 1st team all B1G, 2X 2nd team all B1G, but I won't argue this one.
Marble all time leading scorer. 3rd team all big ten
Garza all time leading scorer. number retired. Two time national player of the year,

Dev is right.

Dev has an argument, he isn't necessarily right.

 

[BondHawk]

Of the ones I'm old enough to remember, I don't think BJ and Stokes should have been retired either. Kind of like how it is called the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Really, Really Good.

Plus I could have won a couple of NBA titles if I had played with Jordan too, so that really shouldn't factor in.

 

[Hawk68]

I’m so glad Gary Barta is perfect so that way he can keep my kids & grandkids from idolizing misfits like the Marbles.

I believe Barta's remarks were very gracious and explained the situation well.

 

[Old_wrestling_fan]

...

I don't get why we have this expectation that the players who are honored must somehow be saints or have never had any problems in their life during college or post-college. Everyone is aware of what was going on in Roy Sr.'s life. It doesn't lessen the impact he had as a player at Iowa, and that is what should be honored. Kudos to Fran for bringing him back into the program in the time period that he did.

Honest question...imagine ANY player being honored for their career accomplishments in a public manner AND then the shamers come out and protest, etc, that he/she doesn't deserve that honor due to other personal shortcomings, specifically to include assault of another person. I think that possibility is very real and something that the UI leaders would need to consider prior to honoring someone in this way.

 

[Franisdaman]

 

[NorthDSMHawk]

We should probably reach out and see who else needs more respect from the program.

Pretty sure Krafcisin still is the only person ever to play and score in two final fours for two different teams. Sounds like he has a case. Hell, we have a current player that’s #1 in a few categories for us, might as well do him too.

 

[mtown66]

C'mon, which 15 players at Iowa were better than Roy Marble?

Luka Garza, Ronnie Lester, Maury Weir, Chuck Darling, Kevin Kunnert, B.J. Armstrong, Fred Brown, John Johnson, Don Nelson, Sam Williams, Adam Hulaska, Carl Cain, Luke Recker, Aaron White, Greg Stokes. I'll stop there.

 

[TritonHawkeye]

What would help this debate might be an understanding of Barta's points in the Hlas article.

"All three of those, through our university process, do not meet the criteria for those retirement requirements.”

 

[mtown66]

This thread is pretty bad. I can't believe the number of Iowa fans racing to pass judgment again on one of their all-time greats. It's pretty disappointing.

I'm out.

Iowa fans generally always go by'' Once a Hawk, always a Hawk'' except of course when that Hawk shuns, denigrate and trashes Iowa. Then it becomes a different story. Iowa fans will defend themselves against all comers, even ungrateful former Hawks.

 

[Fan In Black]

Dev has an argument, he isn't necessarily right.

Yes you are right it is arguable. I would argue that Marble played in the greatest era of basketball talent in the Big10. And he became the all time scorer sharing all four years with Ed Horton and B.J Armstrong. I think the school kind of jumped the gun retiring Stokes jersey. And they did it on the spot. Then you skip a guy and do it on the spot again I can see why they feel hurt.

I dont think BJ's number should be retired either. I think that was a publicity stunt.

12 should be retired. And 55 should be retired. Those are the only 2 in my lifetime that I think deserve it ( if that matters to anyone lol )

 

[Legend12]

Yes you are right it is arguable. I would argue that Marble played in the greatest era of basketball talent in the Big10. And he became the all time scorer sharing all four years with Ed Horton and B.J Armstrong. I think the school kind of jumped the gun retiring Stokes jersey. And they did it on the spot. Then you skip a guy and do it on the spot again I can see why they feel hurt.

I dont think BJ's number should be retired either. I think that was a publicity stunt.

12 should be retired. And 55 should be retired. Those are the only 2 in my lifetime that I think deserve it ( if that matters to anyone lol )

BJ’s number isn’t retired and never has been.

 

[wondergrape]

Yeah, and while we are at it let's donate the University's entire endowment to BLM to make up for what you conceive as bad judgement by Iowa in their lack of providing recognition for Roy.

What does this racial nonsense have to do with anything? It's almost like people who hate "the race card" want this to turn into some kind of racial issue. Newsflash: it isn't to anyone but you.

 

[mtown66]

Franisdaman said:
Dev should have never tweeted what he tweeted. He sounds grossly immature and selfish. Fran, Luka & this team SHOULD HAVE NOTHING to do w/ his issues w/ the UI administration, but he's never going to watch them? He's never going to congratulate Luka on his accomplishments? Grow up.

The tweet: I’ll never watch another iowa game in my life with the amount of disrespect that school has shown me and my family. Love the fans but I’m in no way affiliated or connected to the university.


The UI has not been disrespectful to Dev. And the UI has not been disrespectful to Roy simply because they did not retire his #.

What the UI did do, however, was make a decision 32 years ago where they decided not to retire his #. And that decision has never been overturned for the many reasons that have been discussed in this thread.
Click to expand...

Who TF are you to say who is allowed to feel disrespected by what?

This is proof positive that being an internet tough call is a great way to discuss issues.

 

[mtown66]

What does this racial nonsense have to do with anything? It's almost like people who hate "the race card" want this to turn into some kind of racial issue. Newsflash: it isn't to anyone but you.

You may want a recount. Some people are already making that an issue and the University will do everything it can to avoid it whether they should have to or not.

 

[acic1]

No matter what is or isn’t done, people will be outraged. There’s no way to win.

And this isn’t in defense of Barta. He’s needed to go for years. It’s what comes with the times when every little move someone does ends up in someone becoming outraged and calling for another person’s head.

I understand Devyn’s take. And I under at and the University’s take. It’s hard to say what’s right or wrong.

I do think though, that Barta will never have it retired himself. Clearly, he’s had no intentions of doing it thus far, but doing it now/in the future would make him look even more dumb than he already does (hard to do!) and it would probably be even more of a slap in the face to Devyn. “Hey, we don’t really want to retire this but since we need to look better, we’ll do it for us. Happy now?”

Barta just needs to give it up.

EDIT: also, it’s not a race issue. Except for the idiots turning it into one because they need something to be outraged at.

 

[fivecardstud14]

Luka Garza, Ronnie Lester, Maury Weir, Chuck Darling, Kevin Kunnert, B.J. Armstrong, Fred Brown, John Johnson, Don Nelson, Sam Williams, Adam Hulaska, Carl Cain, Luke Recker, Aaron White, Greg Stokes. I'll stop there.

Yeah you're right. Plenty of Hawk fans say Recker over Marble. Great take.

 

[mtown66]

I think Legend was on to something. You're a weird guy, Fran. I made my point and am not going to participate further. Quit tagging me. I do not care about the self-righteous drivel you continue to post. You're an idiot.

You may be right about Franisdaman, but he isn't wrong about you either. You are also, self righteous and an idiot. Maybe you're each others doppelgangers.

 

[LarryStation]

I don't get the not even close comment at all. Sure Roy was more athletic, but Luka has been considered by MANY to be the top player in all of college basketball the last two years. Something that NO Iowa player ever did, back to back conference player of the year, when the BIG is as good and tough top to bottom as it has ever been, AND back to back national player of the year. Luka has put up numbers that have only been matched by a few players in the country in the last 50 years. As for RM's teams may have won more , I'd say he had considerably more talent around him. I believe there were 7 players on that team that played in the NBA. And yes, i saw Roy play as well as Ronnie Lester and all of the greats in the last 50 years. Luka doesn't have to take a back seat to anyone, and that includes Roy Marble senior.

No one is comparing Garza to Michael Jordan. Roy was constantly compared to Michael. SI did an article about it. Garza is a big. Is he being compared to Russell, Chamberlain, Shaq, etc. No. He is no where close to being as good as Roy.

 

[kceasthawk]

No one is comparing Garza to Michael Jordan. Roy was constantly compared to Michael. SI did an article about it. Garza is a big. Is he being compared to Russell, Chamberlain, Shaq, etc. No. He is no where close to being as good as Roy.

Outstanding, and thats your opinion. One that I don't even remotely share. I watched every game that Roy played, and while he may have been the focus of the opponents defense, he never faced the kind of double and triple team help that Luka has in a confined area of the floor. As for anyone comparing Marble to Jordan, thats ridiculous, but just my opinion I guess. Those same people your saying compared Roy and Mike never put Roy on any AA teams while Mike was a two time player of the year, like some guy named Garza, Hell Roy was never even first team all BIG. You're right though it's not even close......

 

[LarryStation]

Character counts! Luka is a class act on and off the court, unfortunately can’t say the same for Roy.

How do you know?

 

[TritonHawkeye]

No one is comparing Garza to Michael Jordan. Roy was constantly compared to Michael. SI did an article about it. Garza is a big. Is he being compared to Russell, Chamberlain, Shaq, etc. No. He is no where close to being as good as Roy.

I know what you're saying that Roy was special and I agree with you. But in the late 80's lots of players were compared to Michael. Miner was supposed to be the next coming...

 

[Georgia_Hawk]

Soooo.... has Dev previously shared his disappointment with Fran? With Gary? With the U of I?
Or... just a random tweet knocking Iowa?

Seriously ... this is the good and bad about social media... So Dev sends a random message about displeasure (I’m guessing Iowa did not know about) and now the U of I is caught with its pants down trying to make good...

How about a direct conversation if you are upset ...

Instead... he chose the path of someone taking to a Facebook page to complain about your neighbor’s barking dog without ever approaching the neighbor first.

Loved watching Roy ... and Dev... Many know Roy’s off the court issues... Have a conversation with Barta and Fran... Find a solution...Talk... don’t tweet...

How do you know, with total confidence, that Devyn did not approach them first?