Iowa State sweet 16 first year coach. Lol

[HedgeHawk1]

I hate ISU. But past 10 years...20 years..ISU program been far far better..and it isn’t close.

4 Sweet 16’s..4-5 conf tourney titles...Dozen nba players Last 10 years.

40% conf record? Means nothing. Big 12 was the best conference. I can admit that.

Couple lucky wins? Winning in NCAA tourney is damn hard. Match ups and Luck are part of every single game..in any sport.

but past 20 years or so one thing is clear. Guards and defense wins in the NCAA.

A sub 40% conference winning percentage meant Iowa State was basically one wrong committee member away from being a top seed in the NIT.

Agreed that Iowa State has been more successful over the past 20 years. I am envious of their tourney success. But I wouldn’t trade Iowa’s future for Iowa State’s two weeks ago, and two weeks didn’t change things that much.

 

[HawkAssassin]

Miami - ISU is going to be another rock fight. Miami has won 2 games shooting 4-29 from 3 (1-14 and 3-15) while being outrebounded by 20 over the 2 games vs USC and Auburn. Miami is built on defense too.

View embedded media

Miami is the worst defensive team left in the field ranked 123rd. The only thing they do well on defense is turn people over.

USC had 4 starters over 6’9”. 18 turnovers.

Auburn’s guards have been scrutinized all year for making poor decisions. 13 turnovers.

Miami took advantage of good matchups. Iowa failed to.

 

[Hans81]

Kind of takes the starch out of all that Lick blaming pabulum they doled out for Fran over the years. Lick at his worse won 10 games. Time for a new excuse. But hey, they still roll out that 20 losing seasons thing when Kirk falls flat.

It will be interesting to see how ISU does next season without players like Brockington & Kausher? I suppose they could continue to get lucky via the portal.

 

[Hans81]

Yes

I doubt that happens.

 

[Hans81]

Iowa’s best shot SHOULD have been last year, with Luka, Keegan, and Joe as the core. If Fran had played Keegan more, Iowa would/should have been a tough out.

JBo and Connor at guard will not get you very far in the NCAAs. Perkins showed some spark toward the end of the year and in the Big 10 tournament, but still is not a consistent top level guard. So much runs through outstanding guard play and Fran’s specialty is lanky big men.

I would have loved having a wing like Keegan on the Cyclones team this year. We just didn’t have anyone who could score the ball as consistently as he can.

I hope Fran stays at Iowa forever.

That brings up a good point; if the Iowa and ISU rosters are combined this season, is that a Final 4 type squad?

 

[Hans81]

But, But, But....we got a Big 10 Weekend Exhibition Banner to raise.....don't worry about the tournament that 99.9% of the other people in the country care about....just worry about your own little shiny play pretty to stick in the trophy case next to the NIT Participation ribbons.

So, Iowa should have just tried to lose out in the Big 10 Tourney? Give me a break...all ISU fans ever used to talk about is winning the Big 12 conference tourney. However, this year when they lose out early in that, then not a peep was heard about it.

 

[Win5002]

It will be interesting to see how ISU does next season without players like Brockington & Kausher? I suppose they could continue to get lucky via the portal.

I imagine ISU takes a step back, although I think both could come back for a 6th year. I serious doubt Brockington does but I wouldn't be surprised if Kalscheur does come back. ISU does need to crush it in the transfer portal to be good next year or Tyrese Hunter develop an outside shot. If he develops an outside shot he is better than Monte Morris overall, but thats a big "if" to improve his shot.

 

[Win5002]

You would’ve traded Iowa’s future for Iowa State’s future two weeks ago?

This season? No. Future? absolutely.

This season, the way both schools finished are on about par with each other. Conference tourneys are similar to CCG tourney wins. This is Fran's best season as a coach IMO and its not even close the way Iowa finished. Unfortunately, I don't expect him to continue this.

 

[mooresville hawk]

One will never know if the job isn't open and actively seeking candidates. Coaches jump ship all the time for better opportunities when schools recruit and seek them
TJ did in his first year after a 2-22 season what Fran has never accomplished in his life.
Wouldn't surprise me at this point if ISU made the final four.
Fran has sucked other than the Big Ten Tourney this year. I was thrilled the way we were playing the last 6 weeks.
Then the usual same Ole same Ole smacked me in the mouth.
Fran has had 13 years, he's not the answer.
Jmo

Fran’s Teams had not won the B10 tournament until this year. Why can’t one of his teams make the Sweet Sixteen? You may be right and it may not happen under Fran, but this year has shown that the program is still improving. I understand the frustration with the last game against Richmond, but that does not erase what this team accomplished.

They won sixteen games against B10 opponents and the second most games ever for an Iowa team. They finished the season winning 8 of 10 games and then won the B10 tournament. Fran was a candidate for B10 coach of the year. He is not going to get fired right now. Hopefully, he and the program can build on the successes from this season.

 

[83Hawk]

You would’ve traded Iowa’s future for Iowa State’s future two weeks ago?

Two weeks ago? Nice job of picking a time frame to fit your narrative. Why not 2 days ago? Or 4?

Fran has been a head coach for 26 years. No Sweet 16. Zero. Nada. None. That’s a fact.

No, I’m not calling for Fran to be fired. But the Iowa men’s basketball program is never going to be any better than it is right now. It’s been 12 years. It is what it is.

 

[Iafootballfan]

Miami - ISU is going to be another rock fight. Miami has won 2 games shooting 4-29 from 3 (1-14 and 3-15) while being outrebounded by 20 over the 2 games vs USC and Auburn. Miami is built on defense too.

View embedded media

Miami is the 123rd ranked defense on KenPom, they win games due to their 18th ranked offense.

 

[HedgeHawk1]

Two weeks ago? Nice job of picking a time frame to fit your narrative. Why not 2 days ago? Or 4?

Fran has been a head coach for 26 years. No Sweet 16. Zero. Nada. None. That’s a fact.

No, I’m not calling for Fran to be fired. But the Iowa men’s basketball program is never going to be any better than it is right now. It’s been 12 years. It is what it is.

Ok. Two weeks ago, two months ago, 1 year ago, 2 years ago? The point is that there's very limited periods of time during which you would prefer the outlook of the ISU program to the Iowa program.

Why can the program not continue on its upward trajectory? I’m not worried about Fran not making Sweet 16s at Sienna or anywhere else that isn’t Iowa. At Iowa the program was better in Fran’s third set of four years than it was in his second set, and his second set was better than his first. But you’re positive this can’t continue?

 

[HedgeHawk1]

This season? No. Future? absolutely.

This season, the way both schools finished are on about par with each other. Conference tourneys are similar to CCG tourney wins. This is Fran's best season as a coach IMO and its not even close the way Iowa finished. Unfortunately, I don't expect him to continue this.

Is this based almost exclusively on two games? Maybe three with the Iowa/ISU game from this year. Feels like a very small sample size to bet on. I’ll take the guy who’s developed 2 POTY candidates, won 31 games against conference competition, and driven his team to much higher seeds in the tourney the last two years over the guy who’s squad has been slightly less impressive than St Peters over a two game span.

 

[BrunoMars420]

Ok. Two weeks ago, two months ago, 1 year ago, 2 years ago? The point is that there's very limited periods of time during which you would prefer the outlook of the ISU program to the Iowa program.

Why can the program not continue on its upward trajectory? I’m not worried about Fran not making Sweet 16s at Sienna or anywhere else that isn’t Iowa. At Iowa the program was better in Fran’s third set of four years than it was in his second set, and his second set was better than his first. But you’re positive this can’t continue?

History says no

 

[BrunoMars420]

Ok. Two weeks ago, two months ago, 1 year ago, 2 years ago? The point is that there's very limited periods of time during which you would prefer the outlook of the ISU program to the Iowa program.

Why can the program not continue on its upward trajectory? I’m not worried about Fran not making Sweet 16s at Sienna or anywhere else that isn’t Iowa. At Iowa the program was better in Fran’s third set of four years than it was in his second set, and his second set was better than his first. But you’re positive this can’t continue?

Just realized this but you are basing his progress of our program on a set of 4 years each? Omg hahaha. “Well these next 4 years we should get to a sweet 16 derrrr” The leash we allow our coaches is crazy too me. And you judging a coach on his success on sets of 4 years is equally as crazy to me.

The last 8 years have essentially been the same. Good regular season team with great talent only to step on our dicks when it matters in the tourney. The great Fran Fraud

 

[TampaHawkfan]

Just realized this but you are basing his progress of our program on a set of 4 years each? Omg hahaha. “Well these next 4 years we should get to a sweet 16 derrrr” The leash we allow our coaches is crazy too me. And you judging a coach on his success on sets of 4 years is equally as crazy to me.

The last 8 years have essentially been the same. Good regular season team with great talent only to step on our dicks when it matters in the tourney. The great Fran Fraud

Fran has had a lot of good talent in the 8 years you speak of. Marble, White, Uthoff, Jok, Luka, Keegan, Wieskamp, etc.

For the upward trajectory to continue above where it is as I type this, defense really needs to become part of this program's DNA. Not just something they do for certain stretches. It needs to be WHO WE ARE. I have my doubts this will happen (again, history says "No" with Fran's teams).

Will guys like Luka & Keegan continue to walk through our doors and be B10POY and/or 1st Team AA candidates like we've been fortunate to have lately? Even with those guys, we've managed just one NCAA Tournament win the last two seasons. I'm just feeling a plateau coming. But, maybe recruiting will surprise me. Hopefully.

 

[BrunoMars420]

Fran has had a lot of good talent in the 8 years you speak of. Marble, White, Uthoff, Jok, Luka, Keegan, Wieskamp, etc.

For the upward trajectory to continue above where it is as I type this, defense really needs to become part of this program's DNA. Not just something they do for certain stretches. It needs to be WHO WE ARE. I have my doubts this will happen (again, history says "No" with Fran's teams).

Will guys like Luka & Keegan will continue to walk through our doors and be B10POY and/or 1st Team AA candidates like we've been fortunate to have lately? Even with those guys, we've managed just one NCAA Tournament win the last two seasons. I'm just feeling a plateau coming. But, maybe recruiting will surprise me. Hopefully.

I think Fran has proven no matter the talent we can’t get out of the 2nd round. He has plateaued in Iowa

 

[HedgeHawk1]

History says no

What history? The history where I clearly laid out the upward trajectory of the program suggests it can’t continue in the future? That seems an odd inference…

 

[Cydkar]

Is this based almost exclusively on two games? Maybe three with the Iowa/ISU game from this year. Feels like a very small sample size to bet on. I’ll take the guy who’s developed 2 POTY candidates, won 31 games against conference competition, and driven his team to much higher seeds in the tourney the last two years over the guy who’s squad has been slightly less impressive than St Peters over a two game span.

I'll go with the guy who made history, this year, rather than the one who has repeated it.

 

[BrunoMars420]

What history? The history where I clearly laid out the upward trajectory of the program suggests it can’t continue in the future? That seems an odd inference…

Or the past 8 years that has been clearly laid out. The trajectory is great talent and early tourney exits. That is Frans history

 

[mrcyfan]

That brings up a good point; if the Iowa and ISU rosters are combined this season, is that a Final 4 type squad?

If TJ is coaching and he gets to pick 2-3 players from Iowa? He11 Yeah!

If Fran is coaching and picks 2-3 from Iowa State? Doubtful….

 

[mooresville hawk]

I think Fran has proven no matter the talent we can’t get out of the 2nd round. He has plateaued in Iowa

Would you have said halfway through the year that Fran had proven that he could not win the B10 tournament?

 

[HedgeHawk1]

Or the past 8 years that has been clearly laid out. The trajectory is great talent and early tourney exits. That is Frans history

Great talent? So lots of first round draft picks and super highly regarded recruits? Fran has maximized output - he’s found guys and developed them.

Fran’s first four years he had one play in game. The next he has two 7 seeds and two wins. The next four again only two wins, but took a #2 seed to overtime and were seeded second and fifth in the other two tournaments. The one that was canceled they would’ve been seeded sixth per bracket matrix. The trajectory is clear and positive regardless of your willingness to accept it.

Again the best way to have success in the tourney is to be there consistently and with a high seed. That’s obviously the direction in which things have been heading for Iowa. But that doesn’t guarantee success in any one game. BPI gave Richmond about a one in six chance to beat Iowa and I think they had Oregon at nearly even odds. Do those losses hurt? Sure. But the extreme overweighting and overreaction of some of the “fan” base to two unfortunate outcomes against solid competition, in spite of the myriad of other markers of program trajectory, is really just silly.

 

[BrunoMars420]

Would you have said halfway through the year that Fran had proven that he could not win the B10 tournament?

So he won a b10 tournament like Steve Alford who we all hate. And the way we were playing I would have not expected a big ten tourney victory which means absolutely nothing in the world of college basketball. We will be remembered for getting bounced by a bum team named Richmond, not winning the BTT.

Halfway through the year I could have predicted a first round bounce from the NCAA tourney lol.

 

[BrunoMars420]

Great talent? So lots of first round draft picks and super highly regarded recruits? Fran has maximized output - he’s found guys and developed them.

Fran’s first four years he had one play in game. The next he has two 7 seeds and two wins. The next four again only two wins, but took a #2 seed to overtime and were seeded second and fifth in the other two tournaments. The one that was canceled they would’ve been seeded sixth per bracket matrix. The trajectory is clear and positive regardless of your willingness to accept it.

Again the best way to have success in the tourney is to be there consistently and with a high seed. That’s obviously the direction in which things have been heading for Iowa. But that doesn’t guarantee success in any one game. BPI gave Richmond about a one in six chance to beat Iowa and I think they had Oregon at nearly even odds. Do those losses hurt? Sure. But the extreme overweighting and overreaction of some of the “fan” base to two unfortunate outcomes against solid competition, in spite of the myriad of other markers of program trajectory, is really just silly.

Great talent for college basketball. Gessell and Woodbury were highly touted recruits, Aaron white is having a successful career overseas, Marble played in the NBA, Uthoff played in the NBA, Tyler cook is currently in the NBA, Garza and Weezy are in the NBA, Keegan is about to be a lottery pick, and Kris seems to be a good NBA prospect. All of this talent and it only shows for getting bounced in the early rounds of the tourney for 8 years!

I guess you need another 4 year set after 12 years to see some more data that the majority of people already have already concluded, Fran has plateaued at Iowa. Talented teams and early tourney exits

 

[HedgeHawk1]

I'll go with the guy who made history, this year, rather than the one who has repeated it.

I’m not sure movie studios are outbidding each other to tell the incredible tale of the bubble team that finished 4 games under .500 in conference play.

 

[mooresville hawk]

So he won a b10 tournament like Steve Alford who we all hate. And the way we were playing I would have not expected a big ten tourney victory which means absolutely nothing in the world of college basketball. We will be remembered for getting bounced by a bum team named Richmond, not winning the BTT.

Halfway through the year I could have predicted a first round bounce from the NCAA tourney lol.

Liking Alford or not has nothing to do with this. You said the program had plateaued under Fran. This may be the case, but I do not think that this can be said when this team just won the B10 tournament for the first time under Fran and the second most games in one season for any Iowa Team. Both are improvements over prior seasons. Also, there were questions about whether or not Iowa would make the tournament halfway through the year so a first round loss sounded pretty good at that time.

I agree that most will remember the loss to Richmond more than any other accomplishments this year as we all tend to dwell on the negatives over the positives. That has been the case with the 2006 team as well. That does not mean that the other accomplishments did not happen and should be minimized.

 

[BrunoMars420]

I’m not sure movie studios are outbidding each other to tell the incredible tale of the bubble team that finished 4 games under .500 in conference play.

Yet they are in the sweet 16 while you make excuse after excuse for your boy toy

 

[BrunoMars420]

Liking Alford or not has nothing to do with this. You said the program had plateaued under Fran. This may be the case, but I do not think that this can be said when this team just won the B10 tournament for the first time under Fran and the second most games in one season for any Iowa Team. Both are improvements over prior seasons. Also, there were questions about whether or not Iowa would make the tournament halfway through the year so a first round loss sounded pretty good at that time.

I agree that most will remember the loss to Richmond more than any other accomplishments this year. That is the case with the 2006 team as well. That does not mean that the other accomplishments did not happen and should be minimized.

They happened and will be minimized as it was in 2006 lol. Outside of Iowa no one cares about what they did in the BTT

 

[mooresville hawk]

They happened and will be minimized as it was in 2006 lol. Outside of Iowa no one cares about what they did in the BTT

You can lol all you want, but what you said is not true. I am outside the state of Iowa and I really enjoyed the B10 tournament this year. I also enjoyed the previous years Iowa has won the tournament. Fans complained on this site about Iowa's lack of success in the B10 tournament under Fran heading into the tournament. Now that one of Fran's teams has won the tournament, you and others want to say it does not matter. I understand and share the frustration with the NCAA tournament and I hope Fran can get it figured out.

 

[HedgeHawk1]

Yet they are in the sweet 16 while you make excuse after excuse for your boy toy

Internet anonymity would appear to be too much for you to handle. But yes, I do stand by Fran based on the balance of things and the program’s overall trajectory in spite of his lack of success in the tourney.

 

[Ronman]

When the clones were going through their 4 and 3 game losing streaks, there were plenty of fans that thought he was in over his head. They did finish seventh in their league and lost twelve games. Now he's god's gift to basketball. He was very adept at using the portal, something our coach could learn from, but I'm sure there are other schools that took the same approach that didn't have the same success. Taking kids that are unhappy with their original (or second) choice has to be a bit of a crapshoot. It paid off for the clones this season.

 

[mooresville hawk]

When the clones were going through their 4 and 3 game losing streaks, there were plenty of fans that thought he was in over his head. They did finish seventh in their league and lost twelve games. Now he's god's gift to basketball. He was very adept at using the portal, something our coach could learn from, but I'm sure there are other schools that took the same approach that didn't have the same success. Taking kids that are unhappy with their original (or second) choice has to be a bit of a crapshoot. It paid off for the clones this season.

This is true. We tend to focus on the teams that have success with the portal, like Iowa State this year. Maryland, Nebraska and Minnesota relied on the portal pretty heavily this year and did not have the same success.

 

[iahawks10]

We keep hearing “plateaued” yet 9 of the 11 seasons (removing Covid shortened year) have been improvements from the previous season. Many even argued that 2019-20/Covid shortened year was Fran’s best coaching after after losing JBo and Nunge to injury mid season.


2009-10: 10-22 (4-14) *Lickliter

2010-11: 11-20 (4-14) Fran
2011-12: 18-17 (8-10) NIT (1 win)
2012-13: 25-13 (9-9) NIT runner up
2013-14: 20-13 (9-9) NCAA play in round
2014-15: 22-12 (12-6) NCAA 2nd rd
2015-16: 22-11 (12-6) NCAA 2nd rd -25thAP

2016-17: 19-15 (10-8) NIT (1 win)
2017-18: 14-19 (4-14)

2018-19: 23-12 (10-10) NCAA 2nd rd
2019-20: 20-11 (11-9) Covid/NCAA 25thAP
2020-21: 22-9 (14-6) NCAA 2nd rd 8th AP
2021-22: 26-10 (12-8) NCAA 1st rd - BTT Champs - 16th AP

IMO, Iowa has improved 9 of the 11 seasons.

Iowa has qualified for the NCAA tournament seven of the last nine years and finished 25th, 8th, and 16th in the AP in the last three. I don’t believe Iowa is a school that would even seriously consider removing Fran as a coach at this point.

 

[HedgeHawk1]

This is true. We tend to focus on the teams that have success with the portal, like Iowa State this year. Maryland, Nebraska and Minnesota relied on the portal pretty heavily this year and did not have the same success.

So far TJ is falling just short of the bar as established by his predecessor who ended up with three losing seasons out of six, oversaw what was likely the worst season in the history of Iowa State basketball, and was summarily shitcanned.

 

[Lone Clone]

I imagine ISU takes a step back, although I think both could come back for a 6th year. I serious doubt Brockington does but I wouldn't be surprised if Kalscheur does come back. ISU does need to crush it in the transfer portal to be good next year or Tyrese Hunter develop an outside shot. If he develops an outside shot he is better than Monte Morris overall, but thats a big "if" to improve his shot.

ISU has some players coming in who are pretty well regarded. As for transfers. Brockington and Kalscheur were pooh-poohed on this board and neither Grill nor Kunc was considered prizes.

More to the point, what is the standard in terms of equalling/beating this year? A first-division conference finish would be an improvement. I think that's entirely possible. Advancing in the NCAA tournament is largely dependent upon what teams play each other and who gets hot -- or cold -- at the right time. As you guys should know better than anybody.

 

[NI hawk]

We keep hearing “plateaued” yet 9 of the 11 seasons (removing Covid shortened year) have been improvements from the previous season. Many even argued that 2019-20/Covid shortened year was Fran’s best coaching after after losing JBo and Nunge to injury mid season.


2009-10: 10-22 (4-14) *Lickliter

2010-11: 11-20 (4-14) Fran
2011-12: 18-17 (8-10) NIT (1 win)
2012-13: 25-13 (9-9) NIT runner up
2013-14: 20-13 (9-9) NCAA play in round
2014-15: 22-12 (12-6) NCAA 2nd rd
2015-16: 22-11 (12-6) NCAA 2nd rd -25thAP

2016-17: 19-15 (8-10) NIT (1 win)
2017-18: 14-19 (4-14)

2018-19: 23-12 (10-10) NCAA 2nd rd
2019-20: 20-11 (11-9) Covid/NCAA 25thAP
2020-21: 22-9 (14-6) NCAA 2nd rd 8th AP
2021-22: 26-10 (12-8) NCAA 1st rd - BTT Champs - 16th AP

IMO, Iowa has improved 9 of the 11 seasons.

Iowa has qualified for the NCAA tournament seven of the last nine years and finished 25th, 8th, and 16th in the AP in the last three. I don’t believe Iowa is a school that would even seriously consider removing Fran as a coach at this point.

Iowa was 10-8 in conference play 2016-17. Iowa was a stolen game at Minnesota from making NCAA tournament. Overachieving team.

 

[iahawks10]

Iowa was 10-8 in conference play 2016-17. Iowa was a stolen game at Minnesota from making NCAA tournament. Overachieving team.

Corrected. TY

*Time Outs can be hard to hear. Sometimes the audio on the telecast can pick them up, but the refs can’t.

 

[David1979]

Wisky's point guard was out.
Huge factor!

Not really. He wasn't doing anything before he got injured.

 

[David1979]

Defense is extremely important in advancing. So is playing tough and guard play. All weaknesses under Fran.