OT- HS Boys State Finals wrapped up
- Thread starter EvilMonkeyInTheCloset
- Start date
Which states have multipliers that you consider successful? What is your criteria for success with a multiplier?
Any multiplier is a success. Do you think oak hill academy in Virginia should play 1a because they have 140 kids 9-12?
Watching grand view Christian play 1a with 6’8”-7’ kids from Tennessee Mexico and Brazil sprinkled in with kids from the 1/2 million person metro area play kids from towns of 1000-1500 is just embarrassing.
Watching grand view Christian play 1a with 6’8”-7’ kids from Tennessee Mexico and Brazil sprinkled in with kids from the 1/2 million person metro area play kids from towns of 1000-1500 is just embarrassing.
So just put one in and call it good? No need to measure any results. Nice list of states
How many Virginia state titles does Oak Hill Academy have?
Why not have a school play the class of the biggest school in town.
Ie assumption 4a and a pella Christian 3A.
Ie assumption 4a and a pella Christian 3A.
For the record, the head of the girls’ union, when I emailed about Assumption winning 8 soccer titles in a decade, against little 1A towns, replied that their committee determined it was because they had better coaches.
I told her that was odd because they, in the last dozen years, had rookie basketball coaches take them to state 4 times with 2 winning championships…again dropping down 2 classes. Coaching my butt.
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I’m good with any multiplier. Let’s do that with any public school who gets an open enrollee.
That wasn’t my question. I asked how many Virginia state basketball championships they have.
First heard of them when Earl Jones played there.
So Storm Lake St Mary’s and LeMars Gehlen play 3A? St. Mary’s would do well in 3A with their 42 BEDS kids
That solution would also move Western Christian to 1A many years
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I really don’t know the answer to this, how many schools were playing soccer then?
I would be interested in your solution to the classification issue. There are a ton of options to look at just curious about your thoughts
Because they draw from an area of 300,000 people and play against teams in towns that pull from 2,000. See the difference?
Multiplier. A school in a large city shouldn’t be allowed to play 1A and beat up on L&M or Nevada. It’s ridiculous.
Can you share where multipliers have achieved the goal of changing the winners in states?
How do you deal with the public schools and OE?
Thanks, I appreciate your response
How many schools would that affect? In what sports?
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So if kids transfer/ open enroll to Van Meter from Des Moines does the same logic apply?
Very similar to Sioux City Heelan. Play mostly 4A conference, but smaller enrollment I believe.
Is it odd that when asked to support their premise or provide some facts they go silent?
Does it matter how many? There was a stretch where Assumption won a 5A league TEN YEARS IN A ROW, but dropped 1-2 levels each year. Instead of playing other big conference teams they dropped down and played Durant, West Liberty, etc. If you think it’s awesome Xavier, Assumption, Heelan, Regina get to beat up little towns in MULTIPLE SPORTS, I don’t know what else to tell you.
There just is not an easy answer to this issue.
I’ve been a public school educator and coach my entire career, retiring this year. Coached games against a number of private schools.
There are certainly some advantages that private schools have. Some mentioned in this conversation. But if we are about evening then playing field how does a multiplier (who would move almost no private schools up by the way) help a school like Postville or Perry who both have over 90% free and reduced? How does it even out a team like Boyden Hull or Rock Valley with very small free and reduced populations to a far southern Iowa school with very high free/reduced?
Reverse multiplier? Reducing your BEDS based on poverty? The first time that was looked at Des Moines Hoover would have been in 2A basketball. Is that fair?
As you said CID even when multipliers are in play the same teams still win, just up a class.
I’m not trying to belittle any of the suggestions that were made but they just don’t solve the issue. There are fewer states with multipliers (21) than without.
So how do you you solve it? I’ve studied this for a few decades. Read all the minutes from the IAHSAA discussions. There is really not an answer. It’s really complex.
If it’s just about success should we have moved Harlan up to 4A during their football run? If it’s about playing against the same size school as you played during the regular season come tournament time then MOCFV drops a class, Unity Christian would have also dropped a class.
You’ll notice in my post above that the typical multiplier used by states didn’t move teams up. Now what?
Moving only a few private schools would never survive litigation
I know you laughed at the Van Meter comparison but small schools close to large cities have huge advantages (and opportunities) over very rural small schools. How do you account for that with a multiplier?
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Their coach also won a championship with SE Polk I believe, maybe 10 years ago. He’s a former junior college all American that went on to shine at Drake. He is a tremendous coach, person and father.
All that can be true but his behavior at the end of the championship game was pretty bush league.
Harlan is a small town…so good for them. I have zero problems with small towns being powers. I have a problem with big city private schools winning multiple titles in a sport by waxing little towns. It’s wrong. Take Assumption football…they - coaches, administrators, boosters- LITERALLY HAD A MEETING IN A LOCAL BAR to discuss what to do about not winning state in football. This ended up ending conference football for the MAC.
Suggestions on fixing it? If you play in a 5A league you don’t drop down a level, or 2 levels. Look at Assumption’s 8-9 soccer titles in 1A and look who they beat. Softball? Same. It’s a joke. Make them play each other in the playoffs…I don’t care but big city schools ending the dreams of kids from Letts, Iowa is a damn joke.
But like I said, Berger said it was better coaching. Bullcrap.
I do get your frustration Tom, but right now Assumption is just playing by the rules. Ultimately it is a classification issue. They play in the tournament class that their enrollment number dictates.
If you can devise a plan that would address all the issues that come with classifying teams a lot of people would be pretty happy. I know a LOT of things have been discussed and with each option comes a ton of unintended consequences
How about a classification based on how many years the players have been in your school? My private school won state my senior year, and all of the kids on the team had been in private schools since kindergarten. Transfer in during high school your enrollment goes higher.
Good dig. I’ve never had an issue with private schools. The ones around where I coach are just like the one you described. (Well, not Heelan). Darn Dutch/Netherland or Christian Reformers.
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Valley is still the biggest according to BEDS. By about 500
Not according to the BEDS which is the official document used by the state. I posted it a little earlier in the thread. Still around 450 kids short of Valley.
Total side note...
What does make me laugh is looking at some of the sites for schools talking about student to teacher ratio and seeing 18-20:1. Most classes of special needs students is 6-10:1 on their own. Mine are all over 30 except one.
