Is Patrick McCaffery the Austin Ash of the Backups?

[IowasLaw]

I think a lot of fans, and even the stars on this year's team, are amused to see Austin Ash go into the game. They know the game is out of hand and the guy is a 1 trick pony who chucks 3 pointers every time he touches the ball, whether he's wide open at half court or double teamed at the 3 point line. In just 15 mins of playing time this year, he's already shot 9 three pointers (and made 3 of them). If it were a starter, fans would be outraged that he never even thinks about passing the ball to teammates who may be wide open. But as a lovable walkon, it's all in good fun.

But has anyone noticed that Patrick McCaffery is a 4 star version of Austin Ash's shoot first ask questions later mentality? Pretty much any time he touches the ball, he puts his head down, drives, and throws up a wild jump shot/layup or 3 pointer. He misses the vast majority of the time (shoots just 38% from the field), but it doesn't stop him from chucking up another wild shot the very next time he gets the ball. The only problem is, Fran has Patrick as his 1st man off the bench a lot of the time (for unknown reasons when we've got much more productive players behind him on the bench), and he plays when the game is on the line.

If you haven't noticed this trend, re-watch the Indiana game (went 0-4 in a 2 minute stretch where he never passed the ball once). The guy may have all the talent in the world, but he's shooting just 38% from the field. Pass the ball, Patrick, work on your shot, and the game will come to you.

 

[fivecardstud14]

He can get to the spot he wants. Those 8-12 foot shots off the glass will fall. Maybe not this season, but as he gets older & the game slows down, that will his go-to move. And he can rise up over most.

 

[unoHawkeye]

That stretch was in the midst of Iowa’s long scoring drought. Nobody else was scoring so Pat took it upon himself to try to get something to drop. Typically he does not force shots...

 

[blhawk]

It's a complete joke anyone besides Keegan is first of bench. Nepotism is hurting this team as many predicted

 

[TheTruthTheWholeTruth]

nEpoTiSm!!

 

[BlackNGoldBleeder]

While I don't agree PMac is out there wildly taking shots every time he touches the ball, I do agree he shouldn't be playing over Keegan.

 

[littlez]

Sorry Uno Iowa Law is right. We all joke that Nunge loves to chuck it the minute he gets in the game but Patrick is a definite black hole.

 

[unoHawkeye]

Sorry Uno Iowa Law is right. We all joke that Nunge loves to chuck it the minute he gets in the game but Patrick is a definite black hole.

Shots per game per 40 minutes:

1) Garza
2) Wieskamp
3) Nunge
4) Patrick
5) Toussaint
6) Bohannon
7) Murray
8) Fredrick
9) Connor

The difference between Patrick and Murray is 1.5 shots per 40 minutes, so not much. Given that Patrick and Nunge frequently play with the second teamers, this isn’t particularly surprising. While there’s an argument to be made that Patrick shoots more than he should given his FG%, he’s certainly not posting “black hole” numbers. So no, IowaLaw is not right. By the way, the actual number for Pat is 13.2 shots per 40 minutes. Austin Ash’s is 26.7. It’s not even close

Also, you know that if you click “Reply” under my post, it quotes my post and I get alerted of your response?

 

[littlez]

Let’s put it this way, and I understand he plays a lot with 2nd unit guys. Would you prefer he and Nunge be 3 and 4 on that list. I’d prefer JBO and Frederick be in that position. Patrick at 5-6 between him and Murray fine.

 

[silasstarr]

While I don't agree PMac is out there wildly taking shots every time he touches the ball, I do agree he shouldn't be playing over Keegan.

Pat comes in for Joe. Keegan comes in for Connor.

 

[BirdistheWord]

Shots per game per 40 minutes:

1) Garza
2) Wieskamp
3) Nunge
4) Patrick
5) Toussaint
6) Bohannon
7) Murray
8) Fredrick
9) Connor

The difference between Patrick and Murray is 1.5 shots per 40 minutes, so not much. Given that Patrick and Nunge frequently play with the second teamers, this isn’t particularly surprising. While there’s an argument to be made that Patrick shoots more than he should given his FG%, he’s certainly not posting “black hole” numbers. So no, IowaLaw is not right. By the way, the actual number for Pat is 13.2 shots per 40 minutes. Austin Ash’s is 26.7. It’s not even close

Also, you know that if you click “Reply” under my post, it quotes my post and I get alerted of your response?

The 3 Above are out of whack. 3/4/5 need to shoot less and 6/7/8 need to shoot more. ###

 

[TheTruthTheWholeTruth]

The 3 Above are out of whack. 3/4/5 need to shoot less and 6/7/8 need to shoot more. ###

The problem is that 6/7/8 play with 1/2. Yes, they need to shoot more, especially CJ, but not so much more that they take away looks from #1. It’s a tough balancing act.

 

[kzoohawk80]

Prior to the last couple of games my opinion of Patrick would be different right now. Prior to the Indiana game his last 3 games where good and sometimes really good. Is he just a young player or does he not understand his role right now? I will say he's got to start playing tougher. He's not a good rebounder and doesn't particularly shoot well around the rim. He seems like a guy that's been bigger, faster and more skilled his whole life and basketball has been easy for him. I really wish he had Connor's toughness. He's too athletic to be as bad of a rebounder as he is.

 

[Kurt Warner]

OP...your thread blows. Patrick is just fine and is going to be a helluva player so get over it

 

[littlez]

He didn’t say he wasn’t going to be a good player. I agree with you, as I think he will be. He just needs to come in and maybe let the game come to him a little more. Taking a lot of shots and only hitting 38%.

 

[Kurt Warner]

He didn’t say he wasn’t going to be a good player. I agree with you, as I think he will be. He just needs to come in and maybe let the game come to him a little more. Taking a lot of shots and only hitting 38%.

I get what you are saying but I like how aggressive PM is. I would rather him be that way over afraid to shoot. The NW game he was great, last night was kinda a downer for most of the team it seemed. I do get what you are saying though

 

[24 so far]

OP...your thread blows. Patrick is just fine and is going to be a helluva player so get over it

Fortunately it's the last thread from this clown I'll ever see. Optimism shines thru! LOL!

 

[unoHawkeye]

Let’s put it this way, and I understand he plays a lot with 2nd unit guys. Would you prefer he and Nunge be 3 and 4 on that list. I’d prefer JBO and Frederick be in that position. Patrick at 5-6 between him and Murray fine.

I don’t think you’ll find many people who deny that Fredrick should be attempting more shots. The guy is a baller. As far as Pat and Keegan go, they are literally averaging 0.6 shots per game difference on a 0.1 minutes per game difference. You are saying that you would be happy if Keegan attempted one more shot per game than Patrick. Nitpicking. It would hardly make a difference

 

[Ihawkhoops]

No issue with PMac looking to shoot but he does the same maddening crap his brother does. Take an easy uncontested shot and turn it in to some high degree of difficulty momentum going away from the basket using the wrong hand shot. Like his confidence but this isn't IC West and he isn't elevating over guys at this level. Get to space and take the open jumper or use the glass. Keep it simple. Just like Connor refusing to take an open 8 footer and opting for a step back one footed fade away that he makes 10% of the time.

 

[RomanHawk]

I think a lot of fans, and even the stars on this year's team, are amused to see Austin Ash go into the game. They know the game is out of hand and the guy is a 1 trick pony who chucks 3 pointers every time he touches the ball, whether he's wide open at half court or double teamed at the 3 point line. In just 15 mins of playing time this year, he's already shot 9 three pointers (and made 3 of them). If it were a starter, fans would be outraged that he never even thinks about passing the ball to teammates who may be wide open. But as a lovable walkon, it's all in good fun.

But has anyone noticed that Patrick McCaffery is a 4 star version of Austin Ash's shoot first ask questions later mentality? Pretty much any time he touches the ball, he puts his head down, drives, and throws up a wild jump shot/layup or 3 pointer. He misses the vast majority of the time (shoots just 38% from the field), but it doesn't stop him from chucking up another wild shot the very next time he gets the ball. The only problem is, Fran has Patrick as his 1st man off the bench a lot of the time (for unknown reasons when we've got much more productive players behind him on the bench), and he plays when the game is on the line.

If you haven't noticed this trend, re-watch the Indiana game (went 0-4 in a 2 minute stretch where he never passed the ball once). The guy may have all the talent in the world, but he's shooting just 38% from the field. Pass the ball, Patrick, work on your shot, and the game will come to you.

I didn't get much agreement when I said several weeks ago that Patrick should get less time and that Ulis/Perkins should get more time because Patrick isn't adding anything we can't get from Keegan, but we could very well need more bench minutes and experience at guard. Well, here we are.

 

[2432Hawk]

Patrick 14 assists and 7 turnovers

Keegan 8 assists and 14 turnovers

Not to knock either player... just to knock the dipshits in this thread.

 

[HawkLogic]

Pat comes in for Joe. Keegan comes in for Connor.

PMAC has been first off bench before Keegan in a lot of games which leads to Fan second guessing because Keegan to any eye test or statistical comparison is way better than PMAC. . CMAC can play position 1-4, so Fran can have CMAC play another position and does not have to pull him to bring in Keegan if keeping CMAC on the floor is critical

Nunge also comes in at the 4 sometimes before Keegan, so that is also why Keegan's entrance into games has at times seemed overdue. Fran is going to do Fran things. The indiana game Fran through out some strange lineups and they were not effective.

Iowa does need its bench to develop and one or more of the young guys could be critical if they get enough PT to develop. Maybe PMAC is dominating in practice and deserves more minutes/shots. Hard to know for sure as fan.
As hard as he shoots the ball off the glass inside the paint, I would worry he is going to struggle making shots because there is no margin for error.

 

[texas twister]

Patrick had a bad game against Indiana as did JBo and 2nd half Weezy and CJF and Connor. Luka missed his fair share of bunnies too. The whole team had a bad game. It happens.

 

[PHawkKenyon]

I think a lot of fans, and even the stars on this year's team, are amused to see Austin Ash go into the game. They know the game is out of hand and the guy is a 1 trick pony who chucks 3 pointers every time he touches the ball, whether he's wide open at half court or double teamed at the 3 point line. In just 15 mins of playing time this year, he's already shot 9 three pointers (and made 3 of them). If it were a starter, fans would be outraged that he never even thinks about passing the ball to teammates who may be wide open. But as a lovable walkon, it's all in good fun.

But has anyone noticed that Patrick McCaffery is a 4 star version of Austin Ash's shoot first ask questions later mentality? Pretty much any time he touches the ball, he puts his head down, drives, and throws up a wild jump shot/layup or 3 pointer. He misses the vast majority of the time (shoots just 38% from the field), but it doesn't stop him from chucking up another wild shot the very next time he gets the ball. The only problem is, Fran has Patrick as his 1st man off the bench a lot of the time (for unknown reasons when we've got much more productive players behind him on the bench), and he plays when the game is on the line.

If you haven't noticed this trend, re-watch the Indiana game (went 0-4 in a 2 minute stretch where he never passed the ball once). The guy may have all the talent in the world, but he's shooting just 38% from the field. Pass the ball, Patrick, work on your shot, and the game will come to you.

I may get flack for this, but this has to be the DUMBEST thread I have read on here. How do you compare a top 100 scholarship player to a walk on who busts his ass in practice to help get these guys ready for games. Everyone on this team struggles and as a good friend of mine Jordan Montgomery said, “The quickest way to kill something special, is to compare it to something else.” Was the game kinda of weird how it unfolded? YES! Did some of us wonder why Fran rotated who he had on the floor? ABSOLUTELY! But the bottom line is, if you haven’t been in the war room as a coach to make sure you push the right buttons and have the right game plan, don’t criticize. You can have your opinion, much like I am expressing here, but many of you questioned the validity of this 2020 recruiting class, you questioned what was going on with JBo’s shot and now, after a loss (though a bad one) you are ready to blow this whole thing up. Be grateful that our guys are able to play and have not shut down their season. Be grateful that we have arguably the best center in Iowa Basketball history and BE GRATEFUL that we still have a chance to accomplish the goals we set at the beginning of the season. In the end, BE GRATEFUL!!!

 

[HawkeyeInCentralIowa]

I may get flack for this, but this has to be the DUMBEST thread I have read on here. How do you compare a top 100 scholarship player to a walk on who busts his ass in practice to help get these guys ready for games. Everyone on this team struggles and as a good friend of mine Jordan Montgomery said, “The quickest way to kill something special, is to compare it to something else.” Was the game kinda of weird how it unfolded? YES! Did some of us wonder why Fran rotated who he had on the floor? ABSOLUTELY! But the bottom line is, if you haven’t been in the war room as a coach to make sure you push the right buttons and have the right game plan, don’t criticize. You can have your opinion, much like I am expressing here, but many of you questioned the validity of this 2020 recruiting class, you questioned what was going on with JBo’s shot and now, after a loss (though a bad one) you are ready to blow this whole thing up. Be grateful that our guys are able to play and have not shut down their season. Be grateful that we have arguably the best center in Iowa Basketball history and BE GRATEFUL that we still have a chance to accomplish the we set at the beginning of the season. In the end, BE GRATEFUL!!!

Thank you Kenyon. Just as a heads up, this IowasLaw isn’t an Iowa fan. He’s a troll and he’s been banned before.

 

[PHawkKenyon]

Thank you Kenyon. Just as a heads up, this IowasLaw isn’t an Iowa fan. He’s a troll and he’s been banned before.

Thanks for the heads up. Gratitude of what is good in our lives or the the lives of the people we love and cheer for is something our world needs. I love reading message boards for fun, but what is needed during this time in our world, is Gratitude!!

 

[icwesthawk]

Patrick had a bad game against Indiana as did JBo and 2nd half Weezy and CJF and Connor. Luka missed his fair share of bunnies too. The whole team had a bad game. It happens.

And it is the reason the talking heads don't believe in us for a National Championship run. Teams are going to have off nights offensively. What good teams have to be able to do is get stops on the other end and we struggle to do that consistently.

 

[Hawks4Life86]

How can he be the Austin Ash of the backups when Austin Ash is a backup?

 

[SB_SB]

Thanks for the heads up. Gratitude of what is good in our lives or the the lives of the people we love and cheer for is something our world needs. I love reading message boards for fun, but what is needed during this time in our world, is Gratitude!!

I wouldn't take things too serious when it comes to this board. I can't speak for the original poster but I'm thinking he/she was just joking around. You have to admit that some of PM shots seem a bit out of control, but you get that with a young player at times. Personally I think of him more of a Dom Uhl type, where at the end of the game when all the subs are in, he's shooting rather than letting the subs shoot. It's no big deal, just something to joke around about and a reason to talk.

As far as comparing two things, well, isn't that life? When you're analyzing a game, when you play a game, you're comparing two teams. There's always comparisons going on in life. And I get this might be a touchy subject in your world given you have twins and want to stay away from constantly comparing the two. Yes, comparing can be a bad thing but it's not always bad. Like most things in life, too much of one thing is bad.

 

[PHawkKenyon]

I wouldn't take things too serious when it comes to this board. I can't speak for the original poster but I'm thinking he/she was just joking around. You have to admit that some of PM shots seem a bit out of control, but you get that with a young player at times. Personally I think of him more of a Dom Uhl type, where at the end of the game when all the subs are in, he's shooting rather than letting the subs shoot. It's no big deal, just something to joke around about and a reason to talk.

As far as comparing two things, well, isn't that life? When you're analyzing a game, when you play a game, you're comparing two teams. There's always comparisons going on in life. And I get this might be a touchy subject in your world given you have twins and want to stay away from constantly comparing the two. Yes, comparing can be a bad thing but it's not always bad. Like most things in life, too much of one thing is bad.

#RESPECT

 

[SB_SB]

#RESPECT

ok, so you definitely found one thing that we can never have too much of.

If I post something about PM (or any of the players) I try to be respectful. Whether a player makes or misses a shot doesn't define who the person is. Two summers ago I was on campus for my kid and when leaving the dorm PM was ahead of us (way ahead). It would have been perfectly normal for him to just walk through the door and let it shut, but instead he stood and held the door open for us. That stood out to me, he seems like a good kid.

 

[unoHawkeye]

I didn't get much agreement when I said several weeks ago that Patrick should get less time and that Ulis/Perkins should get more time because Patrick isn't adding anything we can't get from Keegan, but we could very well need more bench minutes and experience at guard. Well, here we are.

What’s funny is that not one of the four guys you mentioned plays the same position as another

 

[Hawksfinal4]

Patrick 14 assists and 7 turnovers

Keegan 8 assists and 14 turnovers

Not to knock either player... just to knock the dipshits in this thread.

I hate when people use statistics to make their point. It’s almost like using science instead of made up stuff in peoples head

 

[mooresville hawk]

Thanks for the heads up. Gratitude of what is good in our lives or the the lives of the people we love and cheer for is something our world needs. I love reading message boards for fun, but what is needed during this time in our world, is Gratitude!!

I am not sure how you keep your sanity reading some of the posts on this board. It has to be difficult being a former player and having two sons on the team. Many of us do appreciate the insight that you bring and just as importantly the work that the team puts in for our entertainment. Please continue to share your thoughts and do not let the negative nellies on this board get you down.

 

[SB_SB]

I hate when people use statistics to make their point. It’s almost like using science instead of made up stuff in peoples head

The problem with stats is that you can pick and choose to make your point. This isn't a knock on PM at all, I think he should be playing, but I prefer to play big with KM or go smaller with one of the guards.

 

[LarryMullenJr.]

How can he be the Austin Ash of the backups when Austin Ash is a backup?

 

[HawkRugged17]

I may get flack for this, but this has to be the DUMBEST thread I have read on here. How do you compare a top 100 scholarship player to a walk on who busts his ass in practice to help get these guys ready for games. Everyone on this team struggles and as a good friend of mine Jordan Montgomery said, “The quickest way to kill something special, is to compare it to something else.” Was the game kinda of weird how it unfolded? YES! Did some of us wonder why Fran rotated who he had on the floor? ABSOLUTELY! But the bottom line is, if you haven’t been in the war room as a coach to make sure you push the right buttons and have the right game plan, don’t criticize. You can have your opinion, much like I am expressing here, but many of you questioned the validity of this 2020 recruiting class, you questioned what was going on with JBo’s shot and now, after a loss (though a bad one) you are ready to blow this whole thing up. Be grateful that our guys are able to play and have not shut down their season. Be grateful that we have arguably the best center in Iowa Basketball history and BE GRATEFUL that we still have a chance to accomplish the goals we set at the beginning of the season. In the end, BE GRATEFUL!!!

 

[HawkRugged17]

Thank you Kenyon. Just as a heads up, this IowasLaw isn’t an Iowa fan. He’s a troll and he’s been banned before.

I would say he is the Snidley Whiplash of posters.

 

[RomanHawk]

What’s funny is that not one of the four guys you mentioned plays the same position as another

One of the foundational elements of the construction of the team is interchangeability. The goal is to have the guys ready whose skill sets might predictable be needed at various points in various games.

IMO there has been too many minutes given to too many players at the 3/4 and not enough at 2/3.
That hurt us with IN in trying to counter speed with size with Frederick out.

And we weren't able to take advantage of what we have been doing. What we've all feared is when we had offensive problems, our defense wouldn't be enough to save us. I became very concerned in the first
half with the lapses resulting in uncontested dunks. I would have expected more and better help in the post area. Rather than get corrected, that problem accelerated in the second half and that alone resulted in about 14/16 points.

 

[hawkifann]

Let’s put it this way, and I understand he plays a lot with 2nd unit guys. Would you prefer he and Nunge be 3 and 4 on that list. I’d prefer JBO and Frederick be in that position. Patrick at 5-6 between him and Murray fine.

You know the list he posted isn’t total shots, right? It’s averaged out shots per minute. When the 2nd team is in and you have Toussaint, Patrick, Keegan and Nunge out there together, someone has to shoot besides whichever starter stays out there.